Case 3:12-cv-08123-HRH Document 185-2 Filed 09/05/13 Page 1 of 29

EXHIBIT 2

Jeremiah Darger Deposition Excerpts

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT DISTRICT OF ARIZONA

United States of America, Plaintiff, vs. Town of Colorado City, Arizona; City of Hildale, Utah; Twin City Power; and Twin City Water Authority, Inc., Defendants.

) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) )

No. CV-12-8123-PCT-HRH

THE DEPOSITION OF JERRY DARGER (Videotaped) *** CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT ***

Colorado City, Arizona July 24, 2013 3:00 p.m.

(COPY) PREPARED FOR: MR. SEAN R. KEVENEY Attorney at Law

REPORTED BY: Az Litigation Support, LLC Marty Herder, CCR Certified Court Reporter CCR No. 50162

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2 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 No. 3 12 No. 4 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649 Witness' drawing 215 Witness' drawing 215 No. 1 No. 2 E X H I B I T S Witness' drawing Police reports, Bates labeled HildaleDOJ 6673 through HildaleDOJ 6688 75 96 Examination By: Mr. Keveney Mr. Hamilton I N D E X Page: 5, 208, 217 178, 212

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3 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 For the Defendant Town of Colorado City, Arizona: 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649 Also present: Tisha Hillman, paralegal, DOJ Liz Turrin, Intern, DOJ George Barlow Brent Jensen, videographer GRAIF BARRETT & MATURA, P.C. BY: Jeffrey C. Matura, Esq. 1850 North Central Avenue Suite 500 Phoenix, Arizona 85004 STIRBA, P.C. BY: R. Blake Hamilton, Esq. 215 South State Street P.O. Box 810 Suite 750 Salt Lake City, Utah 84110 For the Defendants City of Hildale, Utah, Twin City Power and Twin City Water Authority, Inc.: COUNSEL APPEARING: For the Plaintiff: UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE CIVIL RIGHTS DIVISON BY: Sean R. Keveney, Esq. Matthew J. Donnelly, Esq. 950 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW Washington, D.C. 20530 THE DEPOSITION OF JERRY DARGER, Taken at 3:00 p.m., on July 24, 2013, at the EL CAPITAN TECH BUILDING, 255 North Cottonwood Street, Colorado City, Arizona, 86201, before Marty Herder, Certified Court Reporter, pursuant to the Rules of Civil Procedure.

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4 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Good afternoon. My name is P R O C E E D I N G S Colorado City, Arizona July 24, 2013 3:00 p.m.

Brent Jensen, certified legal-video specialist with K-Video Productions. Our court reporter is Marty Herder, representing Arizona Litigation Support. Their address is One East

Washington Street in Phoenix, Arizona. We are at 255 North Cottonwood Street, in Colorado City, Arizona, to take the deposition of Jerry Darger on behalf of the plaintiffs in the United States District Court of Arizona case of United States of America versus Town of Colorado City, Arizona, et al. Case No. 3:12-CV-08123-HRH. The date is July 24th, 2013. approximately 3:01 p.m. The attorneys will now introduce themselves. Plaintiffs first, please. MR. KEVENEY: MR. MATURA: Sean Keveney for the United States. Jeff Matura for Colorado City. Blake Hamilton on behalf of And the time is

MR. HAMILTON:

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5 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. BY MR. KEVENEY: Q. Mr. Darger, could you start by giving us some -E X A M I N A T I O N JERRY DARGER, called as a witness herein, having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows: Hildale, Twin City Water Authority, and Twin City Power. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Thank you.

Please swear the witness.

well, I take a step back. My name is Sean Keveney, as I said on the record a moment ago. Justice. I work for the United States Department of

And we've brought a lawsuit against the Town of

Hildale and the town -- and the City of Hildale? MR. HAMILTON: BY MR. KEVENEY: Q. City of Hildale and the Town of Colorado City. City of Hildale.

And some utility companies. Are you familiar with that case at all? A little bit. When was the first time you were told that you

would be testifying today? A. Two days ago or something. I can't remember the

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70 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q. Can you draw me a diagram of where the rooms are

that you're talking about? A. Um, I don't -- it's not my place to draw my

religious buildings. Q. Were you ever in that building while on duty as a

police officer? A. Q. Yes. Did you observe the building while on duty as a

police officer? A. Q. Like? You were in there on duty. I mean, did you open

your eyes and look around while you were on duty as a police officer inside that building? MR. HAMILTON: THE WITNESS: Objection; form. I would imagine that I -- I don't

usually walk around with my eyes shut. BY MR. KEVENEY: Q. So, I'd like you to draw a diagram of where the

rooms were that you were telling me about. MR. HAMILTON: If you saw -- if you observed them

while you were on duty -- again, we've talked before and it's our position that the witnesses -- the witnesses do have a First Amendment right. I'm not instructing him not to answer, but they have a First Amendment to practice the religion that CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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71 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 they choose. And believe at this point in time the DOJ if

they're asking with respect to religious practice would be trampling on this gentleman's First Amendment right. MR. KEVENEY: like a speech. I'm sorry, Mr. Hamilton, that seemed

And I am trying to figure out if there's an

objection in there. Was there? Is there an objection on the table? MR. HAMILTON: It's our -- it's our position that

he has a First Amendment right. And so I'm not instructing you not to answer this, but if you feel like this tramples on your First Amendment right. MR. KEVENEY: Just so I'm clear, is there an

objection on the table to my question? MR. HAMILTON: MR. KEVENEY: Yes. What's the specific objection to my

request that he diagram the meeting room? MR. HAMILTON: Amendment rights. MR. KEVENEY: He was in this building, we That it violates his First

established, on duty as an officer with the CCMO. MR. HAMILTON: MR. KEVENEY: while on duty. Correct. He was in there making observations

And I'm asking him to draw a diagram of

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72 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 before. MR. KEVENEY: MR. HAMILTON: MR. KEVENEY: I believe that -No, I don't believe it was. -- it was. those observations. MR. HAMILTON: Oh. That wasn't your question

If it wasn't, then let's make it perfectly clear. BY MR. KEVENEY: Q. Because I am going to ask questions about your

religious beliefs later on, that I am specifically not -A. I -- I understand that you are, and I -- to put it I'm here

on the record, I do have a First Amendment right.

to represent the Colorado City Marshal's Office as law enforcement, as an employee of the Town of Colorado City. I am willing to answer those. As far as my religious beliefs, I have an amendment right. And as far as I'm concerned, the Department of Justice as United States of America, I don't know that they have -- they're infringing upon my rights to question my beliefs. Q. I want to make sure the record is perfectly clear

about what I'm asking you to do right now. A. Q. Okay. I will in the course of this deposition ask you

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73 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 beliefs. A. Um, I was there on duty, not investigating But simply attending a A. Q. questions about your religious beliefs. I want to make it

clear that I do not believe I'm doing that right now. So I specifically asked you if you were in the FLDS meeting house, that Leroy Johnson meeting house, while on duty. And your answer was yes. Is that correct? Correct. Now I'd like you for diagram for me what you

observed while in the meeting house while on duty. I'm not asking about any of your religious

anything, not on a call of service. religious service. Q. A. Q.

You were on duty; is that right? Yes, I was. I'd like you to draw for me your observations

while on duty in that building, to the best of your recollection. A. I understood that you're not a draftsman -I -- I -- to put it on the record, I do

Okay.

feel like this is violation of my First Amendment right, because I don't know that you need to know what the meeting house looks like. If you did, you might go ask the church if you could go see what it looks like. CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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74 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q. But I will draw a picture. Thank you, deputy. MR. MATURA: While he draws, I'll put on the

record, and you can object if you want to, it doesn't matter to me, but I'll object, but I'll state on the record again that I advise the Department of Justice at some point in time to have one of its hundreds lawyers review the case law on First Amendment rights, both from the Supreme Court and Ninth Circuit, which includes protecting the identity of individuals who share a common belief, including, for example, their places of worship. It's not a hard case to read. I suggest someone

from the Department of Justice read it, because we will be bringing this up to the court in a motion for some kind of sanctions. (Witness draws diagram.) THE WITNESS: This is the door you walk in. Had

like classroom, classroom with monitor on the wall, seats like this. Where whoever was speaking, people in the side room tending their baby or whatever they wanted to do could watch and listen. BY MR. KEVENEY: Q. Could you mark north and south on your diagram,

please, just so we know where spatially the building is CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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142 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. He's the city manager. My question is, is he in your chain of command? I guess, yes. Is he above you in your chain of command? Yes. Have you ever seen him sign things in his capacity

as city manager? A. Q. I've never seen him sign. Have you ever seen any documents he's signed as

city manager? A. Q. manager? A. Q. I would assume it's his signature. And does it -- does it appear to match the I've seen some with his name on them. Have you seen his signature on documents as city

signature that's on this page? A. Q. I don't know. Prior to today, do you have any recollection of

seeing this document? A. Q. Not that I'm aware. Were you given any instructions at any time by

anybody regarding Bruce Wisan? A. Q. No. While I'm thinking about it, I forgot to ask you

something about Willie Jessop. CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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143 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Do you have any reason to harbor any bias toward Willie Jessop? A. Q. No. You don't have any basis to dislike him

personally. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. term? A. know. Q. Operating from that definition of the term, do you I assumed that it meant left the faith. I don't No. Are you familiar with the term apostate? I've heard of it. Do you consider Willie Jessop to be an apostate? I don't. . . Did you say you don't know or -I don't know. What's your understanding of the term apostate? Um, apostate from what? You said you've heard the term. Yeah. Do you have an understanding of the meaning of the

consider Willie Jessop to be an apostate? A. I don't really care. I don't know if he's an

apostate or not. I mean -CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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144 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. Q. A. Q. A. Q. I'm -I don't -- I don't -Let me -- let me take a step back. Okay. Willie Jessop is a potential witness in this case. I'm trying to

You're a potential witness in this case. explore any potential witness bias. Okay?

I'd like to find out if you are biased in any way toward Willie Jessop. Has he -No, I'm not. -- ever beat you up? Has he stolen your

girlfriend? A. Q. A. Q.

I mean those kinds of things.

No. Do you understand what I'm asking you? Yes. So given the definition of apostate, do you have a

personal religious view that causes you to have any bias toward Willie Jessop? A. Q. No. Again, I'm going to ask you one more time, just so

I'm sure the record is clear. Given your understanding of the term apostate that you gave us earlier, do you personally consider Willie CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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145 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Jessop to be an apostate? A. I don't know. MR. HAMILTON: BY MR. KEVENEY: Q. A. Q. I didn't get your answer. I don't know what his religion is. I'm not sure you answered my question. Do you have a view one way or the other on whether Willie Jessop is an apostate? A. Q. I don't have a view on it. We talked about Lenore Barlow earlier. I'm going Objection; form.

to ask you the same question. Do you have a view one way or another on whether Lenore Barlow is an apostate? A. Q. I don't have a view on it. You don't personally consider her one way or the

other to be an apostate. A. Q. No. Have you ever been instructed by anybody that

Willie Jessop is an apostate? A. Q. No. What about Lenore Barlow? Has anybody ever

instructed you that she's an apostate? A. Q. No. Now, I was starting to ask you about Bruce Wisan,

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166 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q. A. Q. BY MR. KEVENEY: Q. church? A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. I'm not. You are not. I am not. Were you at any point a practicing member? Yes, I was. At what point did you stop becoming -- did you Are you currently a practicing member of the FLDS

stop being a practicing member? A. Q. A. A while ago. Can you narrow it down any further? I don't know. A year, over a year. I don't know.

Was it less than two years ago? Probably. It was over a year ago and less than two years

ago; is that right? A. Q. Yes. Do you remember roughly what season of the year it

was that you stopped being a practicing member? A. I don't feel to answer all these religious I'd assert my First Amendment right.

questions. Q. timeline.

Deputy Darger, I'm just trying to nail down a And you've already told me that you were a

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167 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. practicing member and you're not now. I'm not asking you -Well, you're just going down the road of all these

religious questions, and I -- you know, I'm here as an officer of the Marshal's Office. questions on that. But as far as what I believe or when I don't believe or what I'm going to believe in the future, I -- I have a First Amendment right that I would assert. Q. Deputy, I want to be very clear. I am trying very I'm trying I'm here to answer

hard not to ask you the tenets of your faith.

very hard not to ask you your personal religious beliefs. But the allegations in this case are that the Marshal's Office and other elements of city government are controlled by the FLDS church. All I'm trying to nail down, and after which I have two more questions, is a time period. I'm not asking you about your beliefs. You've already testified that you were at one time a practicing member. A. Q. A. Q. Yes, I was. And that you stopped being a practicing member. Yes, I did. And we've established a rough timeline. That you

stopped being a practicing member less than two years ago CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 and more than a year ago. All I'm trying to do is see if we can nail down that timeline any more. A. Q. I don't know. My question is: Do you remember what season of

the year it was that you stopped being a practicing member? A. Q. A. time? Q. A. Q. Let me -I mean. . . No, that's a fair question. I'm trying to work I don't. Was it hot or cold outside? Was it a certain day or was it over a period of

out a timeline so that may -A. Q. I don't know the time. I mean, did you stop being a member over a time

period or -A. Q. Yes. -- was this -- was it like a single event

where you -A. Q. Over a time period. Okay. And that time period was between two years ago and a year ago. A. Yes.

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169 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. Q. Now, I said a couple more questions after that,

and then I want to check my notes and make sure there's no other follow-up. But the two other questions I had is at any point were you -- well, three. Are you familiar with United Order? What's that? I'm asking you if you're familiar with something

called the United Order. A. Q. beliefs. I've heard of it. I'm not asking you your personal religious I'm asking you are you familiar with something

called the United Order? A. Q. Order? A. Q. I would assert my First Amendment right. So you're refusing to answer whether you were a I've heard of it. Were you at any point a member of the United

member of the United Order. A. I would assert my right because I feel that's

infringing upon my religious beliefs. Q. At any point did you consecrate property -- I'll

narrow it even more. At any point did you consecrate property that you bought in connection with your police duties to the United CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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170 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Order? A. Q. Order? A. I would assert my First Amendment right again, What do you mean? Did you consecrate your firearm to the United

because you're asking -- you're fringing upon my religious beliefs. Q. Did you consecrate any other police equipment to

the United Order? A. right. Q. I understand you're going to assert. I just want I stated earlier I'll assert my First Amendment

to make sure I have a clear record. Did you consecrate any of the police equipment that you purchased in connection with your official duties to the United Order? A. We're about the sixth question since said three,

but I would assert my First Amendment right again. Q. Are you going to refuse to answer all those

questions based on the assertion of your First Amendment right? A. Yes. MR. KEVENEY: Let's take a quick break. We are off the record at 7:09.

THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

(Brief recess taken.) CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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177 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 them. called. euthanization? A. Um, I've dealt with a lot of Mr. Stubbs' and his

sister's horses. Q. A. But specifically his horse that was euthanized. There was one that was caught in the cattle guard

and broke its leg or something. And they lifted it out. Lydia called. Later that day she

And wanted somebody to come put it

out of its misery. So I went out there. And one of her friends that

was there asked if he could shoot it with his own rifle. And I said, I think it would be fine. So he got his rifle and shot it, put his rifle away, and I left. Q. That's in addition to the two incidents that we

talked about at the start of the day; is that right? A. Yes. The two that I talk about before, I euthanized This one then he did. The United States, Deputy Darger, may file a

Q.

motion to compel your testimony, the portion of which you -the portion of which for which you asserted a First Amendment privilege. A. Q. Okay. I don't know sitting here today whether we

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178 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. HAMILTON: Q. brief. But I want to follow up on a couple things that Mr. Keveney asked you. He talked to you a little bit about the fact that you are no longer FLDS and when you became a non-practicing member of the FLDS faith, and you said it was between a year or two. Has there been any change in the way -- well, let me back up. Have you previously testified to that fact, that you're no longer FLDS? A. Q. You mean in my POST interview. Okay. So in your POST interview you -- you were Mr. Darger, I know it's late. I'll try to be E X A M I N A T I O N definitely will file such a motion or not, but I want to let you know that's a possibility. A. Q. Okay. With that caveat, I have no further questions at I may have some in response to Mr. Hamilton's

this time. questions. A.

Okay.

interviewed by Utah POST; is that correct? CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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186 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. Go get witness statements. BY MR. HAMILTON: Q. Let me back up. Have you ever responded to one of those calls? Yes. Okay. Run through for me what you did when you Or responded to those calls.

responded to that call. A.

Well, I responded to the call, talked to the

complainant, see what their complaint is that, give them a witness statement. Look at -- talk to whoever they're saying is trespassing. Give them a witness statement. See if

somebody has occupancy agreements. Get everybody's side of why they feel like they have the right to be there. Contact legal advice if I need to, if I feel like there's a question. Contact the marshal, see what -- if I have a question as to. . . Q. Once you finish those investigations, would you

forward that information on to the prosecuting attorneys? A. Yes. MR. KEVENEY: BY MR. HAMILTON: Q. And have you forwarded any kind of -- any type of Object to the form.

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187 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 call or investigation you conducted on behalf of Mr. Chatwin and Mr. Wyler or Mr. Barlow to the prosecuting attorney? A. Q. I have. Did -- has Mr. Chatwin's religion ever come into

play in the way you respond to his calls? A. Q. I don't know what his religion is, but no. Has the fact that he is an agent for the United

Effort Plan Trust as currently constituted with Bruce Wisan as the special fiduciary ever come into play in the way you responded a call involving Mr. Chatwin? A. Q. No. Same questions for Isaac Wyler. Has Mr. Wyler's

religious background or his religion ever come into play in the way you respond to a call involving Mr. Wyler? A. Q. I don't know his religion, but no. And same question with respect to the United Have you responded any differently or

Effort Plan Trust.

the fact that Mr. Wyler is an agent for the United Effort Plan Trust and works at the behest of Bruce Wisan affected the way you conducted any investigations or call involving Mr. Wyler? A. Q. No. Jethro Barlow, has his religion ever come into

play when you've ever responded to a call involving Mr. Jethro Barlow? CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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188 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. A. I don't ever remember going on a call that he

called in, but no. Q. Okay. So you're not sure if you actually ever responded to a call involving Jethro Barlow. A. Q. No. Okay. Do you know who Ron and Jinjer Cooke are? I do. Have you ever responded to a call involving Ron or

Jinjer Cooke? A. Q. A. Q. Responded to a call or dealt with them? Yes. I've dealt with both of them. Tell me about the times you've dealt with Ron and

Jinjer Cooke. A. The time I really dealt with Ron was I stopped him

for speeding once, told him to slow down, gave him a verbal warning. Q. A. Q. Did you cite him? No, I didn't. So did the incident concluded with you just giving

him a verbal warning. A. Q. Yes, it did. Have you had any interaction with Jinjer Cooke?

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189 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. I have. Can you explain the interaction you had with

Jinjer Cooke? A. One time she called one night. I don't know, it

was midnight sometime, middle of the night. Said someone was in her house. son had heard somebody. So I responded up there. She come out, told me that she didn't want me to investigate it, because I was one of those FLDS cops. I said if there's someone in your house, we want to help you, we want to -- if somebody is burglarizing or trespassing or. . . She said, no, I don't want you to help, I'll have Mohave County do it. So Mohave County came out the next day and investigated it. Q. Okay. When you pulled over Ron Cooke, did his religion come into play at all the way you handled that situation? A. Q. No. I didn't know his religion. Her daughter or

Okay. When you responded to Jinjer Cooke, did her

religion come into play in the way you responded to that call? CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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190 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q. Black? A. Q. A. I talked to Bruce Black about a call. Could you describe that incident for me. Off of Mohave Avenue, south of the reservoir, the And one of the older A. Q. No. The fact that she claimed that you were an FLDS

cop, did that affect -- one of those FLDS cops, did that affect the way you tried to conduct yourself? A. No. I just asked her if anything I could do to help. She told me she didn't want me to. So I went on foot around

in the trees and down in the creek to see if I could find anybody, but I didn't. After she told me she didn't want me there, I didn't go into her house or on the property. I went down in

the creek and in the bushes and trees around to see if I could find anybody. Q. A. Are you familiar with Bruce and Ron Black? Bruce and Ron Black. I don't know Ron Black. I know a Bruce Black. Have you ever responded to a call involving Bruce

Blacks own some property there.

gentlemen, I think he said his name Charleen or Sterling or something Black, called and reported a -- somebody CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649

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217 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649 * * * * * ______________________________ JERRY DARGER trailers. They're just -- like they're set there. I mean,

they're probably still movable, but they -- they got sidewalk and skirting and they've been there for 15, 20 years. I don't know. There are -- they don't move. MR. KEVENEY: MR. HAMILTON: read and sign. And you can have the transcript sent to me and I'll get it to you, Officer Darger. THE WITNESS: All right. This concludes the deposition Okay. No further questions.

We'd ask for the opportunity to

THE VIDEOGRAPHER: of Jerry Darger.

We are off the record at 8:20. (Whereupon, the deposition concluded at 8:20 p.m.)

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218 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CONFIDENTIAL DRAFT - SUBJECT TO PROTECTIVE ORDER www.CourtReportersAz.com (480)481-0649 __________________________ C. Martin Herder, CCR Certified Court Reporter Certificate No. 50162 2013. STATE OF ARIZONA COUNTY OF MARICOPA ) ) )

ss.

BE IT KNOWN that the foregoing deposition was taken before me, Marty Herder, a Certified Court Reporter, CCR No. 50162, State of Arizona; that the witness before testifying was duly sworn by me to testify to the whole truth; that the questions propounded to the witness and the answers of the witness thereto were reduced to typewriting under my direction; that the witness elected to read and sign the deposition transcript; that the foregoing 218 pages constitute a true and accurate transcript of all proceedings had upon the taking of said deposition, all done to the best of my skill and ability. I FURTHER CERTIFY that I am in no way related to any of the parties hereto, nor am I in any way interested in the outcome hereof. DATED at Chandler, Arizona, this 28th day of July,