Transcript Day 1

CONFIDENTIAL
FLORIDA STATE UNIVERSITY
INVESTIGATIVE HEARING
BEFORE JUSTICE MAJOR HARDING
VOLUME I
DATE:
Tuesday, December 2, 2014
TIME:
Commenced at 12:20 p.m.

Concluded at 4:46 p.m.
REPORTED BY:
Kimberly S. Bartholomew
Court Reporter
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.

2894-A REMINGTON GREEN LANE
TALLAHASSEE, FLORIDA 32308
(850)878-2221
APPEARANCES:
Justice Major Harding

Hearing Officer
Ausley & McMullen
123 South Calhoun Street
Tallahassee, Florida 32301
Carolyn A. Egan, General Counsel
Panel Member
Florida State University
Suite 211, Westcott Building
222 South Copeland Street
Rachel Bukanc, Ed.D.
Assistant Dean/Director
Panel Member
282 Champions Ways
A4117 University Center
Robyn Blank Jackson
Associate General Counsel
Panel Member
Suite 424, Westcott Building
222 South Copeland Street
Tony Bajoczky, Jr., Esquire
Panel Member
Ausley & McMullen
123 South Calhoun Street
GORDON & REES, LLP

W.M. David Cornwell, Sr., Esquire
Benjamin Levine, Esquire
The Pinnacle Building
3455 Peachtree Road, Suite 1500
Atlanta, Florida 30326
Advisors to Respondent
HUTCHINSON, BLACK & COOK, LLC
Baine Kerr, Esquire
John Clune, Esquire
921 Walnut Street, Suite 200
Boulder, Colorado 80302
Advisors to Complainant
Complainant
Respondent
I N D E X
OPENING STATEMENTS
PAGE
By University
21
By Respondent
29
By Complainant
38
6
7
8
WITNESS
PAGE
Complainant
10
Direct Examination by Justice Major Harding
43
11
Cross Examination on behalf of Respondent
53
12
Redirect Examination by Justice Major Harding
56
13
14
15
16
17
Witness One
67
Witness Two
72
Witness Three
18
75
19
Cross Examination on behalf of Respondent
79
20
Cross Examination by Complainant
80
21
Recross Examination by Respondent
87
22
23
24
25
INDEX OF EXHIBITS
(Exhibits retained by Justice Harding)
CLAIMANT'S
DESCRIPTION
PAGE
Exhibit 4
Questions to Witness One
70
Exhibit 5
Questions to Witness Two
73
RESPONDENT'S
DESCRIPTION
Exhibit 1
Photograph
54
10
Exhibit 2
Photograph
54
11
Exhibit 3
Photograph
54
6
7
PAGE
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
90
The following proceedings were had:
* * * * * * * * * *
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
Counsel,
pleasure to meet you.
have some procedural issues that you wish to
discuss, and I'm willing to hear those at this
point.
And I understand that you
And it would be helpful for the court reporter
and the record will accurately reflect if you would
10
be kind enough to state your name, Mr. Kerr, before
11
you speak, and Mr. Cornwell.
12
13
14
MR. KERR:
I'm Baine Kerr representing the
Complainant as her advisor.

I just wanted to clarify, Your Honor, that we
15
were not requesting two advisors.
16
don't -- it's kind of -- I'm unfamiliar with the
17
procedures enough not to know who really is an
18
advisor and who isn't.
19
20
JUSTICE HARDING:
Although, I
The rules are a little
different from what you learned in law school.
21
MR. KERR:
They are.
They are.
22
Our only concern was that Complainant, if I am
23
required to be in the hearing room, that she not be
24
in the satellite room alone, and just wanted the
25
ability to have someone with her.

Corey Pruitt is available and is there now and
perfectly acceptable for that purpose for us.
do not need another lawyer present, and certainly
not in an advisor capacity.
JUSTICE HARDING:
6
7
We
And what is her
relationship?
MR. KERR:
She was the victim's advocate who
was assigned to Complainant and who has a
relationship that developed throughout 2013 of, you
10
know, supportive, emotionally, and providing
11
assistance of various kinds to her.
12
So they know each well and she has been
13
supportive, and Complainant has a lot of trust and
14
faith in her.
15
JUSTICE HARDING:
16
MR. KERR:
17
18
19
20
21
22
Okay.
And she is a Florida State
employee.
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
Anyone wish to
speak to that?
MR. CORNWELL:
I'm curious.
Certainly at
first blush I don't think we have an objection.

I do have a question, though, which is whether
23
this woman intends -- whether they intend to call
24
her as a witness; and, in that case, I think we
25
have some concern about her being able to hear.

1
2
JUSTICE HARDING:
Do you intend to call her as
a witness?
MR. KERR:
No, she is not on our witness list.
MR. CORNWELL:
JUSTICE HARDING:
MR. CORNWELL:
Then we have no objection.

Okay.
But maybe generally we can
address will we be invoking the Rule of
Sequestration that witnesses will not be in the
room or otherwise be hearing the testimony?
10
MS. BUKANC:
11
JUSTICE HARDING:
12
MR. CORNWELL:
13
14
15
16
That's always the case.

That's always the rule.
Okay.
So we don't have any
objection.
JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
Do you have anything
else, Mr. Kerr?

MR. KERR:
Just a couple of questions about
17
the email from you that we were -- that was
18
forwarded to us yesterday evening.
19
We have been repeatedly told that there can be
20
one advisor, advisors cannot speak but can consult
21
and confer so long as it's not disruptive.
22
those are the Rules from the Code of Conduct that
23
we've relied on and expect to follow here.
24
therefore, we would not -- do not think it would be
25
appropriate for cross examination by advisors of

And
And,
1
2
witnesses.
The procedure that you outlined about
submitting questions, written questions, the
Respondent and Complainant being able to submit
written questions that you would then read as
appropriate to witnesses I think is perfectly good
in keeping with the Code of Conduct, and that's the
way we would like to proceed.
9
10
JUSTICE HARDING:
That's my understanding of
the Rules, and I have no reason to not follow that.
11
Do you wish to speak, sir?
12
MR. CORNWELL:
Not particularly.
I guess we
13
can, when we get there, discuss the most sensible
14
way of communicating the questions to Your Honor.
15
But I anticipate that was the Rule so we're fine
16
with that.
17
Along those lines, at least it seems to be a
18
nexus in my mind, because we have the capability of
19
broadcasting the proceedings will Mr. Levine be
20
permitted, even though he is not participating or
21
in the room, to listen via the conference call line
22
from the room that we have downstairs?
23
24
25
JUSTICE HARDING:
He will not be in the
room -MR. CORNWELL:
That's right.
10
JUSTICE HARDING:
MR. CORNWELL:
No, no.
Respondent will be
with us.
4
5
-- with your client?
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yeah.
Well, I don't know
what the rule is in regard to that.
MS. JACKSON:
Let me just ask this question.
Is there a way that that could not work the
same way that Mr. Kerr has indicated that he could
be present in this room and then his client could
10
be in another room with a support person who is not
11
an advisor?
12
Mr. Levine doing basically the same thing as
13
Ms. Pruitt?
14
Is there a reason why we couldn't have
In other words, when Respondent is in the room
15
with you we could probably have him listening in,
16
we would give that same option to Ms. Pruitt.
17
18
MR. CORNWELL:
That's what I would
anticipate.
19
20
Sure.
MS. JACKSON:
Okay.
See if that works for
you.
21
JUSTICE HARDING:
22
MR. KERR:
23
So Mr. Levine would be able to be with
24
25
That's agreeable with me.
If I could make sure I understand.
Respondent when Mr. Cornwell -JUSTICE HARDING:
No.
11
MR. CORNWELL:
it's the opposite.
No, it's the opposite.
No,
Mr. Levine would simply be playing the role of
assisting me; and, to facilitate that, he will be
on the conference call, and Respondent will be with
me so that Mr. Levine is not advising or consulting
with Respondent.
understand that.
That role is limited to me, we
So in the event, which is unlikely, that
10
Respondent was not in the room and he was with
11
Mr. Levine and the proceedings were going forward
12
then we would cut off the conference call because
13
he couldn't advise him at that time.
14
But that's not going to happen.
15
have Respondent here the entire time.
16
MS. BUKANC:
17
MS. JACKSON:
18
that.
19
out first.
20
21
22
We intend to
Should we clarify that now?

We should probably talk about
Let's see if we can't get this issue figured
MR. CORNWELL:
Yeah.
I'm sorry, I didn't
identify myself on the record as directed.

I am David Cornwell, the advisor to
23
Respondent.
And this is Benjamin Levine, an
24
associate with my firm Gordon and Rees.
25
apologize.
12
MS. JACKSON:
I believe that we could make it
work in exactly the same way for both parties,
especially if there is not a need for Mr. Levine to
be listening in when you are in the room with
Respondent.
MR. CORNWELL:
MS. JACKSON:
Yes.
I think that it would work
exactly in the same manner, that if there was a
time when one of the parties was not in this
10
conference room, I think what I'm hearing is the
11
two of you would be in here as -- either one of you
12
would be in here, and then we would have someone
13
with the participant who is not in the room on the
14
conference call downstairs with a support person.
15
I think that it would work exactly the same way for
16
both parties.
17
18
MR. CORNWELL:
this room --
19
MS. JACKSON:
20
MR. CORNWELL:
21
22
Except Respondent will be in
Okay.
-- and Mr. Levine will be
separated from him in a room alone.

MS. JACKSON:
Okay.
Then we should probably
23
go ahead and talk about how we've prepared to work
24
that.
25
MR. CORNWELL:
Okay.
13
MS. BUKANC:
So the Conduct Code gives -- and
I know we weren't able to actually finish the
information session.
of that session.
5
6
This would have been a part
But the Complainant has the right not to be in

the same room as the Respondent.
MR. CORNWELL:
MS. BUKANC:
So the way that we conduct our hearings is
10
when the Respondent is speaking to the hearing body
11
that person is in this room.
12
is speaking to the hearing body the Complainant is
13
in this room.
14
swapping.
15
16
Understood.
And so she has requested that.
When the Complainant
So there is going to be some
MR. CORNWELL:
Oh, so he will be asked to
leave?
17
JUSTICE HARDING:
18
MR. CORNWELL:
Yes.
I got that.
Okay.
In which
19
case I will decide whether or not to leave with him
20
or to stay in the room.
21
JUSTICE HARDING:
22
MS. BUKANC:
23
MR. CORNWELL:
24
25
Yes.
Right.
Right.
And if I decide to stay in the
room then Mr. Levine cannot or can?

MS. BUKANC:
Can be with him.
14
MR. CORNWELL:
MS. BUKANC:
3
4
Can be with him.
Yes, that's what it sounds like
we're working on.

MR. CORNWELL:
And how about in the instance
where Respondent is in the room with me, can
Mr. Levine listen instead of waiting for the
afternoon transcript?
MS. JACKSON:
9
10
11
I don't know -- Mr. Kerr, I
would be interested to hear if you think that we

can make that equal.
But if you're in the room with Respondent then
12
I don't see why there would be a need to have
13
another person listening in.
But it's really -- I
14
don't mean to be taking over.
It's really up to
15
our Hearing Officer on how he wants to do it.
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
Well, these Rules have been
17
in effect a lot longer than I have.
18
welcome your counsel.
19
20
MR. CORNWELL:
And I would
Can I fill in a blank, though,
if you don't mind, Your Honor?
21
JUSTICE HARDING:
Certainly.
22
MR. CORNWELL:
23
streamline the process.
24
testifying, in the event that we had questions for
25
Justice Harding to ask the witness I will consult
The purpose essentially is to

Whatever witness would be
15
with Mr. Levine.
process or a five to ten minute process if he is
able to hear but not participate in the events.
We can make that a 45 minute
I'm just trying to figure out -- I mean, he is
here for a reason because I rely on him very
heavily.
figure out a sensible way to keep the process
moving.
He is good.
And I'm just trying to
I think that was referenced in an email
10
yesterday, some reference to flexibility to
11
facilitate a smooth process.
12
13
14
15
I mean, I don't see the harm in it, but if you

do we'll abide by the ultimate ruling.
JUSTICE HARDING:
Do you have any concern in
that regard?
16
MR. KERR:
17
do have a concern.
18
like more of a second chair as, you know, in a
19
legal trial and not like Corey Pruitt who is
20
Florida State Victim's Advocate, emotional support
21
person.
22
Not a huge concern, but somewhat I

It's really Mr. Levine sounds
It sounds like a different role.
And I don't necessarily object to it, but I
23
think if -- I think we should be afforded the same
24
ability to have a second legal person to consult
25
with in the same way if we choose to.

I don't know
16
that we would choose to.
MR. CORNWELL:
We certainly don't object to
them doing so.
JUSTICE HARDING:
MS. BUKANC:
I didn't hear.
I was just making sure we had an
actual separate room that is secure with a phone to
even be doing this.
have the ability.
MS. JACKSON:
10
So I wanted to make sure we
We can.
JUSTICE HARDING:
And so then in the event
11
what I hear is you would have no objection if you
12
have the same opportunity, Mr. Kerr, to provide
13
assistance in the same manner.
14
15
And is there an accommodation for that,

Ms. Jackson?
16
MS. BUKANC:
17
think it's fine.
18
The Code allows for it if you
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
Then without
19
objection and having expressed that concern,
20
Mr. Kerr, with the understanding that you would
21
have the same opportunity with your client then I
22
would see no problem for that.
23
MR. KERR:
Understood.
24
MR. CORNWELL:
25
JUSTICE HARDING:
Thank you, Your Honor.

All right.
Anything further
17
from --
MR. KERR:
Not from us, Your Honor.
JUSTICE HARDING:
MR. CORNWELL:
Mr. Cornwell?
No.
But does it make sense to
at least chat for a moment about witnesses that we
intend to get through today?
MS. JACKSON:
The University's witnesses will be presented
9
10
first.
I may be able to help on that.
The University first witness is the
Complainant.
11
MR. CORNWELL:
12
MS. JACKSON:
Okay.
We will then move forward with
13
calling Witness One and Witness Two.
14
two witnesses indicate that they cannot be
15
available until Wednesday morning.
16
Four and Witness Five.
17
this afternoon and we will go to Witness Three for
18
this afternoon.
19
MR. CORNWELL:
20
MS. JACKSON:
21
22
23
24
25
We have had
That is Witness
So we'll skip over those
Okay.
And then we would start with the
Complainant's witnesses after that.

MR. CORNWELL:
This sounds like the whole
afternoon, though, don't you think?

MS. JACKSON:
tell.
I think so, but you never can
But that sounds about right to me.
18
MR. CORNWELL:
Well, my experience is it's
generally longer not shorter than anticipated.
we'll see.
JUSTICE HARDING:
MS. JACKSON:
JUSTICE HARDING:
7
8
9
Okay.
Okay.
Very fine.
Well, then --
Let me make sure.
Are there
anything else?
MR. CORNWELL:
Honor.
Nothing comes to mind now, Your
Thank you.
10
JUSTICE HARDING:
11
MR. KERR:
12
Well, let me just ask.
Okay.
Mr. Kerr?
Nothing further.
The first step in the
13
proceedings are opening statements, I believe,
14
under the Code.
15
But
MS. BUKANC:
The very first step is
16
procedural.
17
reminding everyone of their rights and the process.
18
There might be objections that are stated for the
19
record.
20
The Judge is going to read through
And then opening statement, opening statement
21
from the University, and then opening statement
22
from the charged student.
23
24
25
MR. CORNWELL:
And that will be by the student
or Counsel?
MS. BUKANC:
Everything is by the students
19
directly.
know, that you can write things down for them to
read.
long as it's not directly disruptive.
5
6
But, please remember on both sides, you
You can confer with them as you see fit.
MR. KERR:
As
So opening statements by the
University, then the Complainant?
MS. BUKANC:
MR. KERR:
MS. BUKANC:
Then the Respondent.
Or Respondent.
And then once the Complainant
10
comes in for the -- is that correct -- for the
11
testimony, that's when she will provide her opening
12
statement --
13
MR. KERR:
Okay.
14
MS. BUKANC:
15
And then after all of the witnesses at the
-- and the questioning, yes.
16
very end I believe we are not having closing
17
statements; is that right?
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
We will have the opportunity
19
for very brief closing statements, but most of the
20
closing statements will be contained in the
21
Proposed Orders.
22
MS. BUKANC:
23
JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
24
opportunity to submit.
25
MS. BUKANC:
That Counsel will have the
So I just wanted to clarify who
20
is in the room when.
So when the charged student
is in the room to make a statement or to answer
questions he will be in the room.
Complainant is in the room to make a statement and
answer questions she will be in the room.
University's witnesses are in the room, the
Complainant will be in the other room, the
Respondent will be here.
Complainant has her witnesses she is here.
When the
When the
And then when the

When
10
the Respondent has his witnesses he is here.
11
there will be some swapping out.
12
will not be too cumbersome.
13
14
MR. CORNWELL:
it work.
MS. BUKANC:
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yeah.
Good.
Ms. Egan, do you have
anything?
18
MS. EGAN:
19
JUSTICE HARDING:
20
MR. BAJOCZKY:
21
JUSTICE HARDING:
22
MS. JACKSON:
23
That, hopefully,
We'll figure out a way to make
15
17
So
I have nothing.
Tony?
No, sir.
Okay.
Very well.
We'll go off the record for a
second.
24
JUSTICE HARDING:
Off the record.
25
(A break was taken off the record from

21
1
2
3
4
12:34 p.m. to 1:01 p.m.)

JUSTICE HARDING:
Well, greetings, and thank
you all for being here this afternoon.

My name is Major Harding, and I am the Hearing
Officer that will preside over this hearing we are
about to conduct.
And I think it would be helpful for you to
know in preparation for the hearing I have reviewed
the binder of investigative materials provided to
10
me by the University, and I understand both of you
11
have been provided with those same materials.
12
I have also reviewed FSU's Student Conduct
13
Code, and I have received training on how to
14
conduct a hearing pursuant to the Student Conduct
15
Code, particularly a hearing involving sexual
16
allegations, allegations of sexual misconduct.
17
I have also reviewed the training materials
18
that have been provided to me by Counsel for the
19
parties and supplemental materials provided I think
20
on the 20th, except for the Briefs submitted by
21
Counsel for the Complainant.
22
Now, this hearing is being taped -- not taped,
23
but is being reported by a court reporter, and
24
transcripts will be made available as readily as
25
possible to you as we indicated the other day.

22
And also transcripts will be made available to
the appellate officer for in the event that there
is an appeal in this case.
Now, the purpose of a sexual misconduct
hearing is to address the alleged violations of
Florida State University Student Conduct Code.
it is my responsibility to resolve any questions
that concern the procedure or the admission of
evidence or testimony including the relevancy and
10
And
reliability of any evidence or testimony.
11
The Complainant and the Respondent may not
12
question each other in a sexual misconduct hearing.
13
Instead, I, as the Hearing Officer, will ask
14
questions of the parties and the witnesses.
15
And each party will have the opportunity to
16
ask questions of each witness, and those questions
17
will be passed through to me.
18
And witnesses are not here to tell your
19
stories for you so it is important that you share
20
with me all the information that you think is
21
important that I know.
22
share all of the information that offers your
23
perspective on what has happened.
24
25
This is your opportunity to
Now, this procedure is probably a little

different for lawyers, but it is the University
23
policy that support persons are present and they're
permitted only to confer with and consult with the
party they are supporting, and they may not address
me or speak for you who are the parties.
And what we value above everything else in the
hearing process is your honesty.
It is essential
that you be completely honest with me and that you
demonstrate Florida State University's values and
character by providing truthful testimony here
10
today.
And intentionally being dishonest may
11
result in additional consequences.
12
Now, the sexual misconduct investigative
13
hearing process does not allow and does not follow
14
really the rules of a criminal court of law.
15
for example, formal criminal court law rules
16
regarding the admissibility of evidence are not
17
applicable here in this proceeding.
18
And,
In addition, the standard of proof in a sexual
19
misconduct hearing is the preponderance of the
20
evidence and not beyond a reasonable doubt as in
21
the criminal case.
22
This means that in order for a Respondent to
23
be found responsible I must find that it is more
24
likely than not that the Respondent committed
25
sexual misconduct.
24
Now, please note that this hearing is
confidential and should not be discussed with
anyone who is not directly involved in these
proceedings.
5
6
Now, does everyone present this afternoon

understand what I have just explained?
RESPONDENT:
Yes, Your Honor.
MR. KERR:
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yes, Your Honor, we do.
10
COMPLAINANT:
11
JUSTICE HARDING:
12
All right.
And for Complainant?
Yes, Your Honor.

Very well.
Now, this is a sexual misconduct
13
hearing conducted by Florida State University and
14
it is -- I don't know the name of this building.
15
16
17
MS. EGAN:
We are in the Material Science
Building at the College of Engineering.

JUSTICE HARDING:
At the College of
18
Engineering, Material Science Building, and this is
19
the 2nd day of December.
20
hearings on behalf of the University.
21
22
23
And I am conducting these
The Complainant in this case is Complainant,

and the Respondent is Respondent.
And Respondent, Complainant has alleged that
24
on or about December the 7th of 2012 you engaged in
25
sexual intercourse with her without her consent.

25
Do you admit or deny the allegation?
RESPONDENT:
I did not sexually assault
Complainant.
explains exactly what happened to the best of my
recollection.
6
7
8
9
I am submitting a statement that
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
We'll be glad to
hear that statement in just a moment.

The purpose of this hearing is to investigate
and adjudicate whether or not Respondent has
10
violated certain provisions of the Student Conduct
11
Code; and, more specifically, the purpose is to
12
determine whether Respondent is responsible for
13
sexual misconduct.
14
And the charges have been laid out to you,
15
Respondent, in a letter that was dated October 10th
16
and sent to you by the Interim President of the
17
University and the Vice President of Student
18
Affairs, and you have received that letter; is that
19
correct?
20
RESPONDENT:
21
JUSTICE HARDING:
22
23
Yes, sir.
And so you understand the
charges that have been made against you.

I will ask questions throughout the hearing of
24
both Complainant and Respondent and the witnesses
25
present and the witnesses over the telephone.

26
Complainant and Respondent will have the
opportunity to ask questions of the witness, but
will not be allowed to question each other.
And I have furnished to Counsel a list of the
witnesses that have -- that we expect to hear
during the course of the hearing.
And is it necessary for me to give those
witnesses -- would it be appropriate to do that
now?
10
We expect to hear from Complainant, Witness
11
One, Witness Two, Witness Four, Witness Five,
12
Witness Three, Officer Harris, John Kinsman,
13
, Susan Parmalee, Scott
14
Angulo, Paul Osborn, Jason Newlin, Jamal Roberts,
15
and Bruce Goldberger.
16
And I would like to remind all of you who are
17
going to testify that providing false information
18
in this hearing is itself a violation of the
19
Florida State University Student Conduct Code.
20
And so I would ask each of you, Respondent and
21
Complainant, do you each agree to tell the truth in
22
these proceedings?
23
RESPONDENT:
Yes, Your Honor.
24
COMPLAINANT:
25
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yes, Your Honor.

Thank you very much.
27
1
2
Does anyone have any questions before we

begin?
Anything, any questions?
MR. KERR:
No, Your Honor.
RESPONDENT:
MR. CORNWELL:
No, Your Honor.

You referenced FSU materials as
well as supplemental materials that we submitted.
Are those automatically part of the record or do we
have to move those in formally?
JUSTICE HARDING:
10
The Student Conduct Code?
11
MR. CORNWELL:
I'm not sure I understand.
No.
The investigative
12
documents that were provided to all of us as well
13
as the supplemental materials that we provided by
14
November 20th.
15
The question is whether those are
16
automatically part of the hearing record or do we
17
have to move those into the record?
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
I'm not -- the hearing --
19
The matter submitted to the Hearing Officer
20
contains those records and have been considered and
21
will be considered.
22
23
24
25
MR. CORNWELL:
Okay.
So they're part of the
record.
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
Now, I'm going
to begin the hearing with opening statements.

And
28
giving an opening statement will give each of you
the opportunity to provide a brief introduction
regarding the matters before us.
statement should be concise, and you will have the
opportunity to share detailed information at a
later time in the hearing.
7
8
9
10
We will begin.
Your opening
Complainant, would you like to
make an opening statement, please?

COMPLAINANT:
Your Honor, I was under the
impression that I would go second.
11
JUSTICE HARDING:
12
Did you want to have her in the room to make
13
the opening statement?
14
MS. JACKSON:
Wait just a moment.
I think it makes more sense
15
maybe if we ask for an opening from the Respondent
16
while he is here.
17
JUSTICE HARDING:
18
MS. JACKSON:
Okay.
If Complainant has no objection
19
we can wait until she is in the room.
20
is agreeable.
21
22
23
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
If everyone
And she just
indicated she would go second.

MR. CORNWELL:
I thought that when we were up
24
here earlier you said the order would be FSU and
25
then Respondent.
29
1
2
MS. JACKSON:
Justice Harding's remarks were
the University's opening statement.
MR. CORNWELL:
I see.
MS. JACKSON:
MR. CORNWELL:
JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
I'm sorry about that.

No, that's fine.
All right.
That being the
case then, Respondent, if you wish to make an
opening statement you may do so at this time.
MR. CORNWELL:
Your Honor, he can sit?
10
JUSTICE HARDING:
11
RESPONDENT:
Certainly.
I did not sexually assault
12
Complainant so I will be submitting a statement
13
that explains exactly what happened to the best of
14
my recollection.
15
I understand, Your Honor, that you have tons
16
of experience, and I'm extremely confident that you
17
will agree with me after you hear the truth.
18
I know you don't usually do this so I would
19
like to thank Your Honor for agreeing to hear this
20
case.
21
This statement contains my best recollection
22
of my involvement with Complainant.
I apologize
23
for the graphic nature of the matters I describe,
24
but given the false accusations against me it is
25
important to describe fully and accurately my

30
interaction with Complainant to demonstrate that
she willingly engaged in multiple consensual sexual
acts with me with her full knowledge and consent.
Complainant is lying about me.
I have no
choice but to tell the truth about her.
I did not rape or sexually assault
Complainant.
I did not create a hostile,
intimidating, or offensive environment.
In the short period of time that we were
10
together Complainant had the capacity to consent to
11
having sex with me, and she repeatedly did so by
12
her conduct and verbal expressions.
13
14
15
16
17
I have never used physical violence, threats,

or other coercive means towards Complainant.
Finally, I never endangered Complainant's
health, safety, or well being.
In the late evening of December 6th, 2012 or
18
the early morning of December 7th, 2012 Witness
19
One, Witness Two and I arrived at Potbelly's.
20
of my teammates were also at Potbelly's.
21
Many
At some point I noticed an attractive girl
22
dancing on the dance floor.
A few teammates and I
23
started dancing as well and I worked my way over to
24
this girl and made small talk with her as we
25
started dancing together.
I asked her for her name
31
and she asked me for mine.
She said hers was Complainant.
I told her my name.
To the best of my recollection, Complainant
and I danced together for approximately ten
minutes.
talk and I asked Complainant for her telephone
number.
When we finished dancing we continued to
It was loud in Potbelly's so rather than
yelling her telephone number at me Complainant took
10
my cellphone and entered her telephone number into
11
my phone.
12
into my cellphone we talked some more.
13
something about staying in touch or getting
14
together later, and then I went to mingle with my
15
friends.
16
After Complainant entered her number

I mentioned
Witness One saw me talking to Complainant at
17
the bar and told me he had already gotten
18
Complainant's number.
19
I did not buy Complainant a drink.
20
give Complainant a drink of any kind.
21
give her a shot of any kind.
22
offer to give any drugs to Complainant.
23
I did not
I did not
I did not give or
Around the time Potbelly's was closing Witness
24
One, Witness Two and I left Potbelly's and
25
socialized in front of Potbelly's.

32
Witness One and I thought that Complainant was
interested in both of us.
Complainant a text message letting her know that I
was leaving and asking her whether she was ready to
leave.
I decided to send
Given our prior interaction and her response I
believe that it was clear to Complainant that my
intent with the text was to find out whether she
wanted to leave and go home with me.
10
Complainant replied to my text saying in
11
substance that she was ready to leave and was
12
coming outside.
13
Witness One, Witness Two and I were standing
14
next to the taxi cab when Complainant came outside
15
and voluntarily walked over to us.
16
exactly what was said, but we made it clear that we
17
were leaving, and Complainant made it clear that
18
she wanted to leave with us.
I do not recall
19
Since Potbelly's was closing there were a
20
bunch of students outside of Potbelly's around the
21
outside bar and there were a bunch of taxi cabs
22
parked at the curb in front of Potbelly's.
23
Complainant voluntarily left with us.
24
Complainant was not taken by force or coerced into
25
a taxi cab.
She was fully aware of what was
33
happening.
response to my text that she voluntarily got into
the taxi cab.
She voluntarily left Potbelly's in
If Complainant had protested then I would have
left her at Potbelly's.
protested the students and the taxi cab drivers in
front of Potbelly's would have heard her.
8
9
10
11
Additionally, if she had
Complainant was fully aware of her actions and

she did not protest at all.
Complainant left with
us voluntarily.
The taxi cab ride to my apartment took roughly
12
five minutes.
During the ride everyone was
13
cheerful, talking.
14
We asked Complainant if she had any friends
15
who might want to come to our place and join us.
16
recall that she was calling some friends to come to
17
our apartment.
18
Witness One and I lived together in an
19
apartment on the first floor of Legacy Suites.
20
After we arrived Complainant, Witness One, Witness
21
Two and I went into my apartment.
22
Almost immediately upon our arrival
23
Complainant and I went into my bedroom.
24
standing facing each other kissing and touching
25
each other's bodies.
I eventually asked
We were
34
Complainant if she would perform oral sex on me.
She said that she would.
were on and Complainant willing performed oral sex
on me.
The lights in my bedroom
While Complainant was performing oral sex I
was close enough to my dresser to reach over to it
and open the drawer and retrieve a condom.
8
9
10
Complainant and I also engaged in intense

foreplay and heavy petting during the same period
while she was performing oral sex.
11
I was with her on the bed during foreplay and
12
I may have ejaculated a small amount of semen onto
13
her clothing.
14
Complainant assisted in putting on the condom.
15
I stood on the floor with Complainant on the bed --
16
with Complainant on the bed and we engaged in
17
consensual sexual intercourse.
18
After some time in this position we engaged --
19
we changed positions.
20
and Complainant got on top of me.
21
I got on my bed on my back
Complainant's conduct and other verbal
22
expressions left no doubt that our sex was
23
consensual.
24
25
I recall hearing Witness One and Witness Two

outside of my room.
The door of my room was broken
35
so the door could not close fully or be locked.
some point Witness One came into the room.
Complainant, who was still on top of me, saw
Witness One and told him to get out of the room.
Witness One left voluntarily.
tell me to stop having sex with Complainant.
Witness One did not do anything or say anything to
try to persuade me to stop having sex with
Complainant.
10
Witness One did not
Complainant did not do or say anything to
11
Witness One to express or indicate that she was
12
being forced to have sex with me.
13
Witness One left the room Complainant got up to
14
close the door completely.
15
door was broken and did not close all the way or
16
lock.
17
returned to my bed.
18
In fact, after
I told her that the
Complainant then turned the lights off and
Thereafter either Witness Two or Witness One
19
pushed the door open as a prank.
20
me if there were any way that we could have more
21
privacy.
22
I took her into my bathroom.
Complainant asked
While in the
23
bathroom we began to have consensual sex again.
24
And eventually concluded having sex.
25
At
After we finished having sex we stayed in the

36
bathroom for a few minutes talking and then she
indicated that she was ready to leave.
Complainant dressed herself.
While she was
dressing I asked Complainant where she lived, and
she told me that her place was not far from mine.
I also got dressed and we left my apartment and got
on my scooter.
scooter and wrapped her arms around my waist.
Complainant sat behind me on my
After a short ride, perhaps three to five
10
minutes, we arrived at the curb in front of Sally
11
Hall.
12
off the scooter, gave me a hug, and walked through
13
Sally Hall walkway to her dorm, Kellum Hall.
When I stopped at the curb Complainant got
14
Other than asking Witness One to leave the
15
room, Complainant did not say or do anything to
16
express or indicate that she was upset about
17
anything that occurred before, during, or after
18
consensual sexual activities.
19
From the time I met Complainant at Potbelly's
20
to the time I dropped her off at her dorm
21
Complainant was fully aware of her surroundings and
22
in control of all her faculties.
23
responsive and communicative.
24
personality and was fun to be with.
25
She was
She had a pleasant
During our consensual sexual interactions

37
Complainant engaged in a little sexual talk and
took other actions that made it clear that the sex
was consensual and she was enjoying having sex with
me.
If Complainant did not want to have oral sex
or intercourse with me she was fully capable of
expressing it to me.
numerous students outside of Potbelly's, Witness
One and/or Witness Two, had she done so I would
10
11
The taxi cab drivers, the
have stopped immediately.

Rape is a vicious crime.
The only thing as
12
vicious as rape is falsely accusing someone of
13
rape.
14
accused me, threatened to sue me, demanded
15
$7 million from me, and engaged in a destructive
16
media campaign against me and manipulated this
17
process to the point that my rights have and will
18
continue to be severely compromised.
19
Complainant and her lawyers have falsely
Complainant and her lawyers publicly
20
campaigned to vilify me guarantees that her false
21
accusations will follow me for the rest of my life.
22
At some point they will be held accountable so
23
I have determined that it is in my best interests
24
to exercise my right pursuant to Rule
25
6C2R-3.004(6)(d) of the Florida State University

38
Student Code of Conduct and answer questions where
experienced lawyers and other experts can assist me
in confronting Complainant's false accusation and
where Complainant is subject to the penalty of
perjury and other claims for Complainant falsely
accusing me of rape.
JUSTICE HARDING:
Complainant.
an opening statement?
10
COMPLAINANT:
11
12
13
Thank you.
Complainant, do you wish to make
Are we going to transfer rooms
for that?
MS. BUKANC:
Yes.
Robyn is going to be down
in a minute and we'll do the transfer.
14
MR. KERR:
15
COMPLAINANT:
16
17
18
Okay.
Great.
Okay.
Thank you.
1:26 p.m. to 1:49 p.m.)

JUSTICE HARDING:
Now, Complainant, you have
19
the opportunity to make an opening statement.
20
you wish to do so at this time you may do that.
21
COMPLAINANT:
If
Your Honor, my name is
22
Complainant, I am 20 years old and I am currently
23
studying at the University of South Florida
24
majoring in mass communications with a
25
concentration in public relations.

39
My parents are John and Teresa Kinsman, and
we're from Zephyrhills, Florida where I grew up.
Two years ago I attended Florida State
University.
dreamed of going to FSU and was so excited when I
was accepted here.
As a kid growing up in Florida I
The start of my freshman year was great.
the fall semester of 2012 I was enjoying my
classes, my friends, and had joined a sorority
10
In
which all kept me very busy.
11
MR. KERR:
12
COMPLAINANT:
13
My friends and I would occasionally go out to
14
15
Slow it down.
Okay.
local college bars.

On December 6th, 2012 I went out with some
16
friends to a bar named Potbelly's which I'm sure
17
you have read a lot about in hearing materials.
18
It was there that I met a man that I would
19
later know as Respondent.
20
changed my life.
21
That night has forever
Over the past two years -- sorry.
Over the
22
past two years I have learned a lot about sexual
23
assault and how memory works during trauma.
24
are some things from that night that have become
25
clearer to me with the passage of time and some

There
40
less clear.
Although I know it would have been easiest for
me to just reread and repeat my initial statements,
I have always done and will continue to do my best
to give the most accurate recollection I have of
that evening.
Respondent and his advisors, sobeit.
If that subjects me to criticism by
I remember being raped on Respondent's bed
clearly.
I remember pleading with him to stop
10
clearly.
And I remember one of his friends telling
11
him to stop and saying she is saying no clearly.
12
I remember being carried into the bathroom and
13
Respondent locking the door behind him.
14
him holding me down and raping me while I tried to
15
struggle and resist him.
16
as clearly today as they were in 2012.
17
I remember
I remember these things
I remember sitting in my class the first week
18
of the spring semester of 2013 and hearing the name
19
Respondent for the first time.
20
had never heard of him.
21
Like most people I
Witness Four and I looked him up on Facebook
22
to see a photo only to learn that he had a fan page
23
on Facebook and was an important recruit for the
24
football team.
25
no idea who he was and he never told me.
At the time that I was raped I had
41
I remember thinking that nothing would ever
come of reporting this and blaming myself for it
thinking if only I had less to drink; if only I
fought getting into the cab; if only I stayed with
my friend Witness Four maybe this wouldn't have
happened to me.
Although I know that what Respondent did to me
was not my fault, I would give anything to do that
night over again and just stay home.
10
11
But I can't
do that.
My choices are to go away and pretend like
12
nothing happened or to try to hold Respondent
13
accountable.
14
If pretending like nothing happened were at
15
all possible I might consider doing it.
16
lived with this every day of my life since then,
17
both before and after the media found out.
18
But I have
Since the night of my assault Respondent has
19
become somewhat of a celebrity here.
My life,
20
however, has gone in the opposite direction.
21
Thank you.
Okay.
22
I was forced to leave FSU and my friends here.
23
I was subjected to a number of death threats, and
24
my parents' home and work addresses were posted
25
online.
I have had my most horrible life
42
experience played out and debated in local and
national media that couldn't care a less about me.
Although I know my lawyers are always
advocating on my behalf, sometimes I wish that all
the media and lawyers would just go away.
give anything to just be a normal student again at
FSU.
I would
What I'm hoping for today is for someone with
no other agenda to just listen to what happened to
10
me.
11
Respondent's career.
12
heard.
13
I don't care about football or money or

I just want the truth to be
I know what happened that night, and I am
14
apparently the only one of us who is willing to
15
tell that truth.
16
It was my dream to go to Florida State and
17
there is a part of me that will always love this
18
school.
19
with my professors and friends and my former life.
20
More than anything I wish I was still here
For now I know that is not possible, although,
21
there is a small hope that if Respondent is held
22
accountable maybe I could come back someday.
23
Respondent raped me.
There is no other term
24
for it.
I said it on December 7th, 2012 and I'll
25
say it as long as I live because that is what

43
happened.
It is a night that changed my life.
I know there is nothing that this process can
do to fix that; and, regardless of the outcome,
Respondent will no doubt go on to be an even bigger
celebrity in NFL.
deserves to have some accountability for his
violent behavior, perhaps even being expelled will
have minimal deterrent effect on him.
expulsion discourages even one other woman from
But before he leaves here he
But if
10
trusting him in the future it will have been worth
11
it.
12
Thank you for agreeing to hear my case.
13
hope you're able to do the right thing in the end
14
and find Respondent responsible for each of the
15
charges.
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
Thank you.
17
Now, I believe it's time for you to become a
18
witness.
19
convenience of the court reporter, Mr. Cornwell, if
20
you would come down and have a seat there
21
(indicating).
22
COMPLAINANT:
23
24
25
And I would respectfully ask for the
Yes.
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
Now, you have previously indicated to me,

44
Complainant, that you agree to tell the truth in this
proceeding; is that correct?
Yes, Your Honor.
Okay.
Now, I have heard from your opening
statements your relation of the facts as you understand
them.
happened at Potbelly's.
8
9
Help me understand a little bit about what
Now, you understand that you do have the

choice not to testify.
You can exercise that option and
10
it will not preclude me from making a determination
11
regarding the complaint.
12
testify you may do so, if you do not wish to testify you
13
may do so.
14
15
However, if you wish to
Okay.
MR. KERR:
Your Honor, I'm sorry for
16
interrupting your questioning.
17
sworn testimony?
18
19
JUSTICE HARDING:
She has agreed to tell
the truth in this proceeding.
20
21
Yes.
But is -- this is
MR. KERR:
A
Okay.
Your Honor, the summary of my FSU interview by
22
Sarah Merkin (phonetic) and the materials is quite
23
complete and I don't plan to go over it all again except
24
to the extent that you have questions.
25
You also have four law enforcement interviews

45
I gave that are in the materials.
points in the materials I would like to clarify in
response to Respondent's opening statement.
All right.
Okay.
true.
the case.
8
9
10
11
There are a few
You may do so.
Basically nothing Respondent said is
His false story conflicts with the evidence in
I never consented.
He never told me his name.
I didn't know who he was.
I never entered my number
into his phone, and I never received a text from him.

Respondent raped me twice on his bed where I
12
lay frozen but telling him to stop.
13
put me on the bathroom floor and locked the door and
14
told me that it was locked.
15
And again when he
Then I struggled against him as hard as I
16
could, but he over-powered me and dragged me.
I tried
17
to push and kick him off of me, but he pinned me down by
18
the arms and the leg like (indicating).
19
him to stop, but he covered my face and mouth with one
20
hand and jammed it hard to the side like this
21
(indicating), like on the floor like this (indicating).
22
I believe this is where my head pain came from.
I kept telling
23
He admitted to approaching me in Potbelly's,
24
and I'm pretty sure that the guy who gave me a shot of
25
some liquor was Respondent.

46
In my interview the day of the rape by
Detective Angulo I said the guy who gave me the shot
could have been my attacker.
At the time I'd mistakenly thought he was a
friend of Witness Five's since they were standing near
each other at the bar.
Angulo that I'd only thought that at the moment.
8
9
But I explained to Detective
Officer Fallis wrote that the guy was an

unknown white male friend of Witness Five's.
I have no
10
idea where he got that information from, but I've never
11
said that to anyone.
12
from the interview the same day by Detective Angulo when
13
I say the man was black, tall, and big.
14
That was Officer Fallis's error
I became more certain a few months later after
15
talking with one of my friends, Ashley, who had been
16
there and seen the guy at the bar was wearing a red
17
shirt and dark jeans which Respondent --
18
I'm sorry, the guy at the bar what?
19
She, Ashley, had seen the guy at the bar.
20
She had seen, okay.
21
Yes.
22
MR. KERR:
23
THE WITNESS:
24
25
Okay.
He didn't hear this part.

Oh.
Yeah, my friend, Ashley, who had been
there that night and seen the guy at the bar was wearing
47
a red shirt and dark jeans which Respondent had also
been wearing.
3
4
THE WITNESS:
This one?
MR. KERR:
THE WITNESS:
And should I address this now?
No.
Okay.
If there were any truth to what Respondent
said he would have said it under oath.
the sexual interaction is completely fabricated.
10
I'm happy to respond to your questions about
11
those or any other matters.
12
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
13
14
His account of
Okay.
Thank you.
And let's go back to the question
regarding what happened at Potbelly's.
15
Okay.
To what extent?
Do you just want me to
16
tell you --
17
Well, when you met and that sort of thing.
18
I don't remember ever meeting Respondent in
19
the way that he said that we met.
And like I said here,
20
I believe that Respondent was the man who gave me the
21
shot at the bar which would have been the first time
22
that I had met him.
23
I did give my phone number to Witness One.
I never gave him my phone number.
24
When you say shot, what are you talking about?
25
A shot of alcohol.
48
A shot of alcohol?
Yes.
Okay.
I'm not sure.
Were you drinking any other kind of alcohol
What kind?
that evening?
Yes, sir.
And what was that?
Me and two of my friends, Witness Five and
10
Witness Four, had split about four or five like just
11
regular mixed drinks earlier in the night.
12
13
14
Okay.
And tell me about getting into the --
going out and getting into the taxi cab.

A
This is one of the parts that is a little bit
15
kind of hazy.
I did not get into the cab willingly.
16
wouldn't say that I was forced or -- I wouldn't say that
17
I was forced into the cab, but I believe that I was
18
scared.
I was scared into getting into the cab.
19
All right.
20
I mean, I -- I'm not really sure how to --
And scared about what?
21
Scared because these are three men who I've never met
22
who are all very much bigger than me.
23
would happen if I didn't get into the cab.
24
a fear kind of feeling.
25
Scared about what

It was just
What drew you outside of Potbelly's that

49
night?
I was leaving or --
With your friends that you had come --
Yeah, I was looking -- I was looking for
Witness Four.
We had gotten separated.
And it wasn't
like unusual to get separated from my friends.
Sometimes we would talk to other people, like our other
friends and stuff.
And so I think that at that point we were --
10
me and Witness Four were separated and -- I don't know
11
if she was looking for me.
12
so I had went outside and it was pretty late then so I
13
was looking for her to leave.
14
15
16
Okay.
I was looking for her.
And
The amount of alcohol that you consumed
that night, was that a typical amount?

A
I can't say exactly how much alcohol I had
17
because we were all sharing the drinks.
18
say, yeah, probably a typical amount.
19
for me to be completely drunk if you want to say or --
20
but it was pretty typical, yes.
21
JUSTICE HARDING:
22
MR. BAJOCZKY:
23
JUSTICE HARDING:
24
25
But I would
And not enough
Do you have anything?
No, sir.
Okay.
I have no further
questions.
All right.
Maybe I do.
50
1
2
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
You had -- you have described that the sex
that you engaged in was non-consensual.
got to his apartment where did you go?
But when you
Whenever we got to his apartment and we were
getting out of the cab Respondent had me by the arm and
led me into -- inside of his apartment.
Okay.
Into his bedroom.
10
And then basically what happened then?
11
Respondent, after leading me into his bedroom,
12
13
14
And then where did you go from there?
he undressed me and got on top of me and raped me.

Q
Okay.
And you said that someone came into the
room?
15
Yes.
16
And who was that?
17
The someone I believe to be Witness Two came
18
into the room.
19
One coming into the room.
20
21
Okay.
I don't have any recollection of Witness
Did you know either one of them before
that evening?
22
No.
23
And you did -- what did you say to him as he
24
25
was undressing you and forcing you to have sex?

A
I said please stop, no, multiple times.

51
1
2
3
remember pleading just for him to stop.

JUSTICE HARDING:
further.
THE WITNESS:
JUSTICE HARDING:
I don't have anything
Okay.
Thank you.
Through Counsel does
Respondent have any questions?

MS. BUKANC:
So what you will do is work with
him to write them down and then give them to the
Judge.
10
JUSTICE HARDING:
11
MR. CORNWELL:
12
MS. BUKANC:
13
JUSTICE HARDING:
14
Yes, we will have questions.
Okay.
All right.
Shall we take
that time right now to do that?
15
MS. BUKANC:
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
17
That's correct.
Yes.
Okay.
Thank you.
You may
then be excused.
18
MR. CORNWELL:
19
MS. JACKSON:
Thank you.
We wanted to get some
20
clarification from you on this issue we have about
21
advisors and support people.
22
Apparently Mr. Clune is in the building and I
23
wanted to make sure that I clearly understood what
24
your ruling was in terms of allowing support
25
persons in the room, and then also listening in by

52
1
2
phone.
Presently we have Respondent in another room
with Mr. Levine.
she is not on the phone, she is not participating.
5
6
7
And then we have Ms. Pruitt but
So if we have Mr. Clune here how do we think

that could work?
MR. CORNWELL:
I would imagine the same way,
that he can be with whomever in a room while on the
phone.
10
11
JUSTICE HARDING:
And you have no objection to
that?
12
MR. CORNWELL:
No.
13
MS. JACKSON:
Okay.
Well, then what I'll do
14
is I'll ask Ms. Pruitt to step outside and we'll
15
reactivate that phone in 115.
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
17
MR. CORNWELL:
18
19
20
21
I don't care if she stays in,
really.
MS. JACKSON:
Well, she is a University
employee so I'd rather her not be there.

MR. CORNWELL:
Understood.
22
make sure it's not --
23
MS. JACKSON:
24
25
Okay.
Okay.
I just wanted to
Well, thank you.
appreciate that.
JUSTICE HARDING:
You may advise and confer
53
with Respondent and bring the questions for me to
ask.
3
4
MR. CORNWELL:
Okay.
We'll try to be quick,
Your Honor.
JUSTICE HARDING:
Off the record.
2:10 p.m. to 2:43 p.m.)
9
10
JUSTICE HARDING:
13
Okay.
These are questions
that have been requested by the Respondent.
11
12
Thank you.
CROSS EXAMINATION
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
Complainant, when you left Potbelly's and went
14
outside were there numerous students outside of
15
Potbelly's that evening?
16
Yes.
Like I said, it was kind of like the
17
end, like it was getting late so a lot of people were
18
kind of like leaving and stuff.
19
20
21
And were -- and you said there were also
numerous cab drivers, cabs and cab drivers?

A
I don't specifically remember.
But if you
22
want me to speculate then, yes, there usually are
23
several cabs.
24
25
Okay.
I have some pictures here, and for
Counsel, too.
54
If my understanding is correct, the picture
that I'm handing to you is the picture of the front of
Potbelly's?
Yes, sir.
Okay.
Mr. Kerr, would you just write 1 on the
back of that, please?
MR. KERR:
(Respondent's Exhibit 1 was marked for
9
10
11
Yes, Your Honor.
identification.)
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
And then this is a picture, photograph, as you
12
would walk outside of Potbelly's and go to the left; is
13
that correct?
14
Go to the left to go to campus?
15
No.
If you just -- a picture going down to
Oh.
Yes, Your Honor.
16
17
the left?
A
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
19
(Respondent's Exhibit 2 and Exhibit 3 was
20
21
22
And that's number 2.
marked for identification.)

BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
And this picture that I'm showing you now is
23
number 3, and that is a picture of walking outside of
24
Potbelly's and looking down to the right?
25
I assume.
Yes.
55
Okay.
And the next question is, you did not
scream or make any other outcry to anyone outside of
Potbelly's that night, did you?
No, there was no screams.
And no other outcry?
MR. CORNWELL:
I'm sorry, I think we're
entitled to her answer.
JUSTICE HARDING:
MR. CORNWELL:
10
Yes, your answer, please.
Okay.
If you're -- there was some -- there was some
11
struggle, but I wouldn't say an outcry.
12
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
13
Okay.
You also did not scream or make any
14
other outcry to the cab driver while he was driving the
15
four of you to Respondent's apartment; is that correct?
16
Yeah.
At that point I was kind of just really
17
like scared and kind of -- I was in a state of just kind
18
of terror.
19
So, no, there was no screams or outcries.
All right.
The next question is, when you
20
left the cab and were taken by your arm towards
21
Respondent's apartment you did not scream or make any
22
other outcry to any of the residents of the apartment
23
building; is that correct?
24
Yes.
25
And in addition to the numerous students in

56
front of Potbelly's isn't it true that there also were
security personnel in front of Potbelly's?
I'm not sure.
4
5
JUSTICE HARDING:
And I have a few more that I would like to

ask.
8
9
10
11
Those were the
questions that were asked by the Respondent.
6
7
Okay.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
Respondent indicated that he and you had
danced during the course of the evening.
Is that true?
12
No.
13
Did you ever talk with him during the course
14
15
of the evening?
A
The only time that I believe that I had any
16
conversation with Respondent was whenever he bought me
17
the shot at the bar.
18
the person that bought me the shot at the bar.
19
Okay.
Which this is just I believe he is
There is statements by other witnesses
20
that you showed them a text regarding a request to meet
21
outside and there was conversation in regard to that
22
text; and, if my memory is correct, something to the
23
effect, well, go ahead and go.
24
25
Witness Four, one of the people who I went out
with that night, says that she saw a text in my phone

57
from an unknown person, an unknown number, that said
something along the lines of meet me outside.
personally do not remember these texts.
And I
The next morning they were not -- well, not
even after the assault they were not in my phone, there
was no text messages.
text messages and I have no proof of those text
messages.
So I have no recollection of any
In reference to getting into the car -- or to
10
the cab, did you have any other way to get home?
11
did you arrive at Potbelly's?
12
13
14
How
Our friend Ashley drove Ashley, me and Witness
Four to the -- to Potbelly's.

Q
Okay.
Help me understand.
Now I believe
15
after the alleged assault you were dressed and you got
16
on the back of a scooter with Respondent?
17
Yes.
18
And he drove you back -- rode you -- I don't
19
know whether you drive or ride a scooter, but rode you
20
back to your apartment; is that correct?
21
Well, somewhat, yes.
Afterwards he said you
22
can leave now and at that point I really didn't know
23
where I was so he offered to give me a ride home on the
24
scooter.
25
And when he asked me where I lived I told him

58
I lived in Sally Hall which is not where I lived, but it
was a dorm that's close to where I was living at that
time so he took me there.
Well, why did you get on the scooter?
Because I had no idea where I was and I was
6
7
8
9
really -- just didn't know what to do otherwise.

Q
You made some statement earlier about his
hiding his face?

A
While we were in the bathroom he pushed my
10
face to the side, and I believe this was so I couldn't
11
see him or --
12
But you had seen him earlier in the evening.
13
Pertaining to the man who gave me the shot or
14
15
pertaining to -Q
Well, that you had had -- I'm wondering why it
16
would appear that he was turning your face at that time
17
to avoid your recognizing his face when you had been
18
with him the entire evening.
19
answer, I don't know.
And you may not know the
20
Yeah, I'm not really sure about that.
21
When did you first feel pressure or
22
23
intimidated in regard to this potential sexual assault?

A
Whenever I was outside of Potbelly's and the
24
three guys were trying to get me into the cab would be
25
the first time that I felt scared or intimidated.

59
And then when did you first express no to him?
When we were in the cab the person sitting
next to me, Respondent, was like touching my leg and
stuff, and that's when I said like please don't -- like
don't touch me, like please stop in the cab.
6
7
JUSTICE HARDING:
10
Ms. Bukanc, do
you have any questions?
8
9
All right.
(A brief break was held off the record.)

BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
The question is, you did not -- you did not
11
make an outcry or scream in getting into the cab, but
12
was there a struggle in getting into the cab?
13
I mean, the point that I was trying to make
14
there was that I didn't get into the cab willingly.
15
like I mentioned before, I don't think that I was forced
16
in, like I don't think that somebody picked me up and
17
put me into the cab.
18
hundred percent like willing to get into that cab.
19
I'm not really sure what kind of like outcry or whatever
20
it was.
21
And
But at that time I was not a

So
But something to be noted with that also is I
22
had my ID and money in my back pocket which I later
23
didn't have.
24
the money was still in my pocket.
25
some sort of struggle occurred for my ID to come out of
The ID, I didn't have the ID later.
But
So I believe that
60
my pocket.
Okay.
And what was the seating arrangement
inside of the cab?
I was sitting right behind the driver.
On the left hand side of the backseat?
Yes.
Okay.
And Respondent was sitting next to me.
And where was the other two?
10
Witness Two was on -- also in the backseat,
11
and Witness One was in the front seat.
12
Okay.
I think you have answered this in a
13
way, but did you ever verbally make it known to the cab
14
driver or anyone else that you did not want to be in the
15
cab?
16
17
I made it verbally known that I didn't want to
be touched while I was in the cab.
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
19
MS. BUKANC:
Okay.
All right.
I just want to ask one question
20
because I'm worried that if we don't ask everything
21
later on we can't bring people back in.
22
COMPLAINANT:
23
MS. BUKANC:
Right.
That's fine.
And this is part of the reason
24
why the Judge is asking questions related to the
25
intimidation piece.
And you've given reports
61
already so we're not trying to, you know, burden
you with more questions.
But I think that we're trying to understand
more about that intimidation and what exactly was
it.
intimidated?
get in the cab.
What was it specifically that made you feel

Because you said you didn't want to
COMPLAINANT:
MS. BUKANC:
10
Right.
And that's when it started, that
you started feeling afraid?
11
COMPLAINANT:
12
MS. BUKANC:
Right.
But from your statements and from
13
what I'm hearing we're still unclear what that
14
exactly means.
15
COMPLAINANT:
Okay.
I'll try to kind of --
16
MS. BUKANC:
17
COMPLAINANT:
18
I mean, I think for the most part the being
19
scared or being intimidated was because there is
20
three men here who I haven't met before this night;
21
who I don't know; who are all significantly bigger
22
than me; who are trying to get me into a cab to go
23
with them.
24
done.
25
before.
Is that okay?
Yeah, that's fine.
And this is something that I've never
I've never gone home with a guy from a bar
62
And so that was why I was kind of intimidated.
I wasn't sure how to react or what to do in that
situation.
If that helps.
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
Thank you.
Anything further?
I guess with that now it would be appropriate,
and please help me if I am following the Rules
correctly, to call the next witness and that would
be Respondent --
10
MS. BUKANC:
11
Well, do we feel like all the
questions needed have been asked?
12
MR. KERR:
13
JUSTICE HARDING:
14
MR. KERR:
15
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
16
17
18
I have two if I could pass them?

You may.
I hope you can read that.
On the outside wall with the three men did you
send any message to anyone?

A
Oh, right.
I did.
There is a text that I
19
sent to Witness Four that said come find me.
20
believe this is whenever I was outside getting into --
21
or about to get into the cab or somewhere in that time
22
period where I texted Witness Four to come find me.
23
24
25
Okay.
And I
And how did you recover your driver's
license?
A
There was a girl who wrote me on Facebook a

63
few days after and said I found your ID on the ground,
like on the curb outside of Pots.
with her a few days later to get that.
And then I met up
And now so that the record is clear, in order
to -- this is my question, not -- in order to get a cab
ride you have to show a student identification in order
to get a reduced rate; is that correct?
8
9
Yes.
There is certain cab companies who do
like if you show your Florida State ID they will give
10
you -- it's like a $4.00 cab ride or something like
11
that.
12
13
I didn't take cabs often.

JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
That's fine.
you very much.
14
Anything else?
15
All right.
16
You have questions?
17
MR. CORNWELL:
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
19
your client and advise him?
Thank you.
We might.
Do you want to confer with
20
MR. CORNWELL:
21
MS. BUKANC:
22
MR. CORNWELL:
23
JUSTICE HARDING:
24
25
Thank
Yes.
We'll put you back on mute.

This will be quick.
Okay.
2:57 p.m. to 3:07 p.m.)

64
1
2
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
On page 288 of the materials that were
furnished there is a description of the text, the
following calls and texts, and we can show that to the
witness.
MR. CORNWELL:
JUSTICE HARDING:
8
9
I can give you my copy.

Yeah, let me have yours.
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
The first text is from Complainant to Witness
10
Four, and that is at, what, 12:50 -- or 1:50.
11
12:50.
12
MR. CORNWELL:
13
JUSTICE HARDING:
14
15
No,
12:50.
12:50.
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
And the content of that is, "Come find me."
16
And then at 1:45 you have, "Do you have my ID?"
17
that before --
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
19
MR. CORNWELL:
20
21
Was
Is that alleged assault?
After.
The question is after.
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
The question is, the first text was before,
22
and the second question was after at 1:45 the assault;
23
is that correct?
24
I'm not a hundred percent sure on this.
25
You're not sure.

65
I'm not -- I'm really not sure.
Okay.
3
4
5
And this text, the question is, was
this text sent after you were allegedly assaulted?

A
Okay.
Can I ask a question then?
help me.
In what respect?
About this.
It would
It would help me under -- it
would help me answer that question.
All right.
10
If you look at where it says times 1:40 and
11
then the recipient number and then the content 001, if
12
that was whenever I was calling Witness Four then this
13
was still before the assault has happened.
14
15
16
Okay.
And did you sit next to the door behind
the cab driver?

A
Yes.
17
JUSTICE HARDING:
18
MR. CORNWELL:
19
JUSTICE HARDING:
20
21
22

Anything further of this
witness?
MR. CORNWELL:
Nothing from Respondent, Your
Honor.
23
MR. KERR:
24
JUSTICE HARDING:
25
Okay.
No, Your Honor.

Very well.
I think it would
be appropriate to call the next witness.

66
MS. BUKANC:
JUSTICE HARDING:
MS. BUKANC:
4
5
6
7
Okay.
Will you arrange for that?
Well, yes.
Do you want to put it
on mute?
3:10 p.m. to 3:22 p.m.)
JUSTICE HARDING:
I'm Major Harding.
case.
Have a seat.
Greetings.
I'm the Hearing Officer in this
10
What is your name, sir?
11
WITNESS ONE:
12
JUSTICE HARDING:
13
are a student at FSU?
14
WITNESS ONE:
15
JUSTICE HARDING:
I'm Witness One.

All right.
Witness One, you
Yes, sir.
All right.
As a student you
16
understand that you have the right to not answer
17
any of the questions that are asked of you.
18
Do you understand that?
19
WITNESS ONE:
20
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yes, sir.
I would like to remind you
21
that providing false information is a violation of
22
the Student Conduct Code.
23
24
25
And do you agree to tell the truth in these

proceedings?
WITNESS ONE:
Yes, sir.
67
JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
And everything that
is said in this room today and tomorrow and
elsewhat is private, cannot be shared with anyone.
You understand that?
WITNESS ONE:
JUSTICE HARDING:
MS. BUKANC:
Yes, sir.
All right.
One of the things we didn't talk
about in here, but do you need us to introduce
ourselves so you know who you're talking to?
10
11
JUSTICE HARDING:
That's a good idea, but I
was getting ready to do that.
12
In addition to myself, this is Ms. Egan who is
13
General Counsel for FSU, Tony Bajoczky who is with
14
me at the Ausley Law Firm, this is Rachel Bukanc
15
who is running this operation, and this is Mr. Kerr
16
who represents Complainant, and you know the rest
17
of the folks.
18
everything that is said.
19
WITNESS ONE:
20
21
22
The court reporter is taking down
Okay.
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
All right.
We are here relating information
23
regarding an alleged sexual assault on December the 6th
24
or 7th of 2012.
25
roommate or are a roommate of Respondent; is that
And I understand you have been a
68
correct?
Yes, sir.
And do you have any recollection of the events
4
5
6
7
that took place on that evening?

A
I exercise my right not to answer the
question.
Q
Okay.
And does that exercise of right go to
any question that might be asked of you in this
proceeding?
10
Yes, sir.
11
JUSTICE HARDING:
12
Anything that I need to do more?
13
MS. BUKANC:
14
Okay.
Very fine.
Do we need to actually say the
kind of questions we want to ask?
15
(A brief discussion was held off the record.)
16
MS. BUKANC:
We still need to give the
17
opportunity for each, the Respondent and
18
Complainant, to ask questions.
19
JUSTICE HARDING:
Very well.
20
If you will confer with your client and if you
21
have any questions I will be glad to have them
22
write --
23
24
25
MS. BUKANC:
They can actually ask these
questions directly.
JUSTICE HARDING:
Hum?
69
1
2
MS. BUKANC:
directly.
They can ask these questions
They don't have to pass them to you.
JUSTICE HARDING:
would have the right?
MS. BUKANC:
JUSTICE HARDING:
MS. BUKANC:
But the Respondent
Yes.
And Complainant?
Yes.
They don't have to be
written.
JUSTICE HARDING:
10
11
Okay.
MR. CORNWELL:
Okay.
We intend to rely on prior
statements so we have no questions.
12
MR. KERR:
We have questions, but I take it
13
from Witness One's answer earlier he will not
14
respond to.
15
like just to submit the questions so that there is
16
a record of what was not responded to.
And I guess for the record we would
17
JUSTICE HARDING:
18
MS. BUKANC:
19
MR. CORNWELL:
20
MS. BUKANC:
21
22
All right.
Very well.
Thank you.
Could we have a copy?
You don't have an extra copy, do
you?
MS. EGAN:
I don't know if it's what he is not
23
responding to, it's what you intend to ask just so
24
the record is clear.
25
questions.
He hasn't not answered those
He said he is not answering any.
70
JUSTICE HARDING:
just the questions.
MS. EGAN:
JUSTICE HARDING:
That's right.
These are
That's different.
And so we can ask these
questions -- I guess she could ask these questions,
but I'll ask him.
MR. CORNWELL:
We don't have an objection to
them being submitted for the purpose of the record
if he intends not to answer.
10
MS. EGAN:
11
MR. CORNWELL:
12
13
Yeah.
I just want to make sure we get
a copy.
MS. EGAN:
I didn't have an issue with the
14
submission of them, just how they were being
15
categorized.
16
He didn't specifically refuse --
JUSTICE HARDING:
In that event then for the
17
purpose of the Rules make sure they are received
18
into evidence and marked by the court reporter,
19
then there is no need to ask this witness these
20
questions.
21
22
23
24
25
Very well.
These will be received then as
Exhibit 4.
(Complainant's Exhibit 4 was marked for
identification.)
MR. KERR:
This is not exactly the same, but
71
close.
MS. EGAN:
We can make copies.
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yeah, we can make the copy
and provide that to you.
MR. CORNWELL:
JUSTICE HARDING:
That being the case, this witness may be
MS. JACKSON:
We'll bring down the next
witness.
11
12

3:26 p.m. to 3:30 p.m.)
13
JUSTICE HARDING:
14
WITNESS TWO:
15
JUSTICE HARDING:
16
Number 4.
excused.
9
10
Number 4?
You are Witness Two?
Yes, sir.
And are you a student at
FSU?
17
WITNESS TWO:
Yes, sir.
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
My name is Major
19
Harding, and I'm the Hearing Officer in this case.
20
This is Ms. Egan who is General Counsel to FSU,
21
Mr. Bajoczky who is a lawyer in my firm, Ms. Bukanc
22
who is -- I understand you may have met her in the
23
past.
24
WITNESS TWO:
Yes.
25
JUSTICE HARDING:
You understand she knows all
72
the Rules with regard to running this operation.
And have you met Mr. Kerr, the Counsel for
Complainant at the far end?
WITNESS TWO:
No.
JUSTICE HARDING:
All right.
How are you doing?

And you know Respondent.
As a student you have the right to
answer or not answer any of the questions that are
propounded to you during the course of this
proceeding.
10
And also this is a private, confidential
11
proceeding, and you are not permitted to share what
12
goes on in this proceeding with anyone other than
13
those of us who are around this table.
14
15
WITNESS TWO:
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yes, sir.
And I would like to remind
17
you that providing false information is a violation
18
of the Student Conduct Code.
19
20
And do you agree to tell the truth in this

proceeding?
21
WITNESS TWO:
22
23
24
25
Yes, sir.
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
Okay.
Now, you understand the proceeding and
what it is about.
It is in regard to a sexual event on
73
the night of December the 6th and 7th of 2012.
And I understand you were with Respondent on
that evening and have been a witness previously in that
regard.
5
6
And I would like for you to begin by telling

me what happened that you are aware of on that evening?
I choose not to answer anything.
Okay.
9
10
You do that.
And is that to any
question that is asked of you by Respondent or

Complainant in regard to this matter?
11
Yes.
I choose not to answer.
12
You choose not to answer any questions?
13
Yes, sir.
14
JUSTICE HARDING:
15
list of questions that --
16
MR. KERR:
All right.
Do you have a
I do, Your Honor, as before.
We
17
would like to submit the questions that have gone
18
unanswered that we would have asked.
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
JUSTICE HARDING:
We will submit those in as
Exhibit 5.
(Complainant's Exhibit 5 was marked for
identification.)
JUSTICE HARDING:
And with that is there
anything?
MR. CORNWELL:
Just I suppose we should say
74
something about questions on the record.
MS. BUKANC:
Yeah.
MR. CORNWELL:
We choose to rely on prior
statements and transcripts, therefore, we have no
questions for this witness.
JUSTICE HARDING:
Thank you.
WITNESS TWO:
MS. EGAN:
10
Very well.
Thank you.
You may be excused.

Okay.
Thank you all.
Thank you.
MS. JACKSON:
If we could take just a couple
11
of minutes.
We are trying to get our next witness
12
here a little early.
13
MR. CORNWELL:
Who is that?
14
MS. JACKSON:
Witness Three.
15
16
3:32 p.m. to 4:23 p.m.)
17
18
JUSTICE HARDING:
this correct?
19
WITNESS THREE:
20
JUSTICE HARDING:
21
You are Witness Three; is
Yes.
Okay.
You are a student at
FSU?
22
WITNESS THREE:
Yes.
23
JUSTICE HARDING:
And as a student you
24
understand you may choose not to answer any of the
25
questions that are posed to you by me or in this

75
proceeding.
WITNESS THREE:
JUSTICE HARDING:
Yes.
And you understand that this
is a private, confidential proceeding, and nothing
that happens here in your presence should be
disclosed to anyone in regard to this matter.
THE WITNESS:
10
Yes, I understand that.
JUSTICE HARDING:
And, lastly, I would like to
11
remind you that providing false information is a
12
violation of the Student Conduct Code.
13
So in light of that do you agree to tell the
14
truth in this proceeding?
15
WITNESS THREE:
16
17
18
Yes, I do.
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
Okay.
And you understand what this proceeding
19
is about, it's a claim that Respondent had sex with
20
non-consent to Complainant?
21
Yes.
22
And this matter allegedly occurred on the
23
night of December the 6th or early morning the 7th in
24
2012.
25
that there was contact made and you went to see her; is
And I understand you were contacted by her or
76
that correct?
Yes.
And what time was that?
Probably like 3:00 a.m. or so.
On the 7th?
Yes.
Okay.
And what drew you to her -- to her
apartment or to her quarters?
She had posted on Twitter saying basically --
10
I don't know, just freaking out saying like someone
11
help, someone call me.
12
was four or five tweets in a row.
13
Like just freaking out.
And it
So I texted her and asked if everything was
14
all right.
15
hysterically crying and said that she was just raped.
16
And she called me right away and was like
And so I hopped out of bed because it was like
17
3:00 in the morning so I was just kind of laying in bed
18
like scrolling through my phone.
19
bed, grabbed my keys and ran out the door.
20
And so I hopped out of
And then I just stayed on the phone with her
21
like the whole time I was driving over just telling her
22
like where I was as I passed streets like how close I
23
was.
And then I arrived to her.
24
And where did you live at the time?
25
I lived on Tennessee and Dixie, Campus Park

77
Apartments.
And how far is that from where she lived?
Like ten or so minutes.
In the car?
Yeah.
Okay.
7
8
9
And so what happened when you got to
her quarters?
A
I went upstairs to her room and she was like
just sitting on the bed crying.
And I was trying to
10
like ask her what happened, but she was like really
11
hysterical and was kind of like trying to piece it all
12
together.
And immediately I was like --
13
And so what did you do then?
14
I just kind of like -- I sat next to her and I
15
was saying that she should call the police.
But she was
16
scared because she had been under-age drinking so...
17
I'm sorry, she was scared because of what?
18
She had been under-age drinking so she was
19
nervous about getting in trouble for that.
20
And so finally I don't know if she called her
21
parents or her parents called her, and her parents also
22
said like it's fine, like we're not mad at you, call the
23
police.
24
one who called the police.
25
And so like she gave me the okay and I was the
Do you know what time that was?

78
1
2
3
4
I mean, it was probably like maybe 20, 30
minutes after I arrived.

Q
Okay.
Maybe 20.
What was -- and describe for us her
condition when you saw -- when you got there.
Like I said, she was like just kind of sitting
on the bed.
tell she was freaked out like something had just
happened.
whole thing.
She was like really shaky.
And she seemed very like confused by the

She was hurting.
10
head hurt.
11
was just in pain.
I don't know.
She kept saying like her
And then -- I don't know, she
12
Did she ever pass out?
13
Not that I saw, no.
14
Okay.
15
Like I could
And what happened then?
You called the
police?
16
Uh-huh.
17
And what did -- what happened then?
18
I called and like talked to them for a while,
19
and then a police officer showed up.
20
police, not the --
I called the FSU
21
I'm sorry, what?
22
I called the FSU campus police, not like 911.
23
Okay.
24
So she showed up pretty quickly.
25
And --
MR. CORNWELL:
I'm sorry.
She said not 911?
79
I dialed the campus police, not 911.
FSU police number.
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
4
5
Okay.
And so do you remember who came?
It was a woman.
Okay.
Complainant after that?

A
I was there the whole time.
hospital with her.
11
in the morning.
13
I don't know her name.
And how long did you stay with
10
12
Do
you remember the officer who came?
Like the
Okay.
I went to the
I was there until probably like 8:00
And I may have asked this, but did she
ever black out or pass out?
14
Not that I saw.
15
Not that you saw.
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
Does Respondent have
17
any questions he would like for me to ask of this
18
witness?
19
MR. CORNWELL:
20
21
22
23
I think we do.
CROSS EXAMINATION
BY JUSTICE HARDING:
Q
Did she give a description of the person who
assaulted her?
24
Yes.
25
And how did she describe him?

80
She said he was black, kind of tall, I think.
That -- I'm pretty sure she said like muscular, like
big.
I can't fully remember every detail.
Did she tell you where she was that evening?
She said she was at an apartment -- oh, where
she was beforehand?
Yes.
She was at Potbelly's.
And she told you that?
10
Yes.
11
And did she tell you how she got out of
12
13
Potbelly's and to an apartment?

A
I don't think she really remembered at the
14
time.
15
fully remember.
16
She said she thought it was a cab, but she didn't
Okay.
17
JUSTICE HARDING:
18
MR. KERR:
19
JUSTICE HARDING:
COMPLAINANT:
23
25
Very well.
Complainant, you
may ask the witness any question you wish.
22
24
I believe Complainant actually has
some that she can ask herself over the telephone.
20
21
Do you have any questions?
Okay.
Thank you.
CROSS EXAMINATION
BY COMPLAINANT:
Q
Hi, Witness Three.

81
Hi.
What was your first reaction whenever you
3
4
heard me on the phone that night?

A
I was scared.
I just kind of jumped out of
bed immediately and grabbed my keys.
pajamas.
scared.
I was still in my
Like I just didn't even have a thought.
Okay.
I thought something was wrong with you.
I was
What do you mean by you were scared?

I was
10
scared for your safety and for you more so than me.
11
it was just kind of an instinct.
12
without really a thought.
13
14
15
Okay.
I just jumped and went
I was just scared for you.
Why did you encourage me to call the
police?
A
Because you had told me that you were raped.
16
So I just have always learned to call the police no
17
matter what.
18
you for drinking which I know was your concern.
19
20
21
Me
And I knew that the police won't be mad at
Okay.
And can you go over kind of what my
demeanor was whenever you arrived at Kellum?

A
Yeah.
You were just very like shaken up.
You
22
were like just kind of like kept to yourself almost.
23
You were sitting on your bed.
24
weren't yourself because you're usually very like bubbly
25
and like jumpy and huggy and stuff, and that wasn't how
Like I could tell you
82
you were.
really knowing like what to say or what even really just
occurred.
You were just to yourself and scared and not
Okay.
So prior to that night and early
morning December 7th, 2012 had you ever seen me so
distressed as that?
No, never.
I feel like the most stressed I
may have seen you is studying for like a chem exam which
is completely different than what you were that night.
10
11
12
Okay.
So that was in no way normal for me to
act that way?

A
No, not at all.
Like I said, you're usually
13
the happiest, bubbliest person ever.
14
knew I was so like -- you were so scared and possibly
15
like badly hurt.
16
phone.
17
Okay.
And that's how I
I didn't know at the time over the
How would you describe my range of
18
emotion from the time that we first talked on the phone
19
until the time we left the hospital?
20
When I first arrived you were like -- well,
21
when we were first on the phone you were hysterical.
22
Like I feel like I could hardly like get any words out
23
of you that's why the whole time on the phone you were
24
just crying and I was trying to tell you where I was
25
like street by street.

83
And when I like got there I think we like
talked for a few minutes and you were still like very
scared, like shaken up.
parents and you were like crying with them.
like they may have calmed you down a little bit.
And then you had called your

But I feel
And then by the time the police got there you
were able to actually speak which was an improvement
from the phone call because on the phone call you were
like literally just straight hysterics.
10
And then I had -- when we were in the hospital
11
room you like -- you seemed like you had kind of like
12
come to grips with like what had happened.
13
able to like calm yourself down a bit.
14
left during your examination, I had sat in another room.
15
So then when I came back to say bye you still,
You were
And then I had
16
obviously, like seemed a little like different but less
17
hysterical or scared.
18
19
20
Do you recall me describing being in pain
other than being raped?

A
Yeah, because I remember like asking you like
21
if you hurt, and you said, yeah.
22
had hurt and you didn't know why that was.
23
when you were talking to the police, not necessarily to
24
me, you had said that you had like genital pain.
25
Okay.
And I know your head

And then
Did I ever say directly that I had been
84
hit in the head -- hit on the head, or was I just more
generally complaining of head pain?
3
4
5
No, you were just saying that your head hurt,
you didn't know why it hurt.

Q
And did I ever say anything to you that I
indicated -- that indicated that I had consented to any
of the sexual acts committed by Respondent?
No, definitely not.
Did you observe anything about me that gave
10
you any reason to doubt my statement to you that I had
11
been raped?
12
No.
13
As we spoke on that night did I have any idea
14
15
about the identity of the man that did this to me?

A
No, you didn't know at all.
You were
16
gathering pieces, you were just trying to find anything
17
you could remember about him.
18
And have we spoken since that night?
19
About this?
20
21
Not -- no, not really.
spoken like friendly like, hey, what's up.

Q
Okay.
We've
But not --
So you placed the call to the police --
22
to the Florida State Police at 3:22 a.m.
23
while you were on the phone is that her I hear in the
24
background.
25
They asked you
What could be heard by the person on the other

85
1
2
3
4
end of the phone?

A
I think they heard you on the phone with your
parents.
Q
Okay.
Pertaining to that, like what would it
have been that they would have heard, talking or crying
or like what exactly?
I mean, probably a mixture of both.
Okay.
9
10
11
And then also on that recording of that
call you say -- you say she is very shaken up.
What
does that mean, or what do you mean by shaken up?

A
Just your body language and the fact that you
12
were having trouble recalling step-by-step what had
13
happened.
14
tell me.
15
you'd be like, oh, wait, before that this happened,
16
wait, and then this happened.
You like couldn't
17
remember in a straight story.
It was very scattered.
18
19
It was very scattered when you were trying to

Like you would remember one piece and then
COMPLAINANT:
have.
Okay.
Thank you so much.
20
WITNESS THREE:
21
JUSTICE HARDING:
22
I think that's all we
Of course.
Thank you.
Respondent, do
you have questions?
23
MR. CORNWELL:
We do.
24
JUSTICE HARDING:
25
MS. EGAN:
He can ask them.
I wonder if it would be helpful to
86
listen to the 911 call and have her talk us through
it.
3
4
5
JUSTICE HARDING:
I would certainly have no
problem with listening to it.

MS. EGAN:
If we have it.
Yeah, I don't have -- I don't have
an authenticated copy.
internet which, you know, I guess she could tell us
if it was complete or not.
I just thought I would suggest it.
10
JUSTICE HARDING:
11
MR. BAJOCZKY:
12
MR. KERR:
13
MR. BAJOCZKY:
14
Well, and we actually have the
recording if that's what you're looking for.
16
MS. EGAN:
19
20
21
to her to maybe walk it through.

MR. BAJOCZKY:
That's the recording of the
interview.
MS. EGAN:
If it's not, you're not going to
hurt my feelings.
JUSTICE HARDING:
23
MR. BAJOCZKY:
25
Is this --
I just thought it might be helpful
22
24
We've got the transcript.
Tab 2 I think is the transcript.
JUSTICE HARDING:
18
It may not be helpful.
We have it.
15
17
I only have what's on the
Oh, there it is.
Here.
That's the audio recording of
the TPD call.

JUSTICE HARDING:
Okay.
But before we do that
87
then --
2
3
MR. BAJOCZKY:
with?
4
5
MS. EGAN:
JUSTICE HARDING:
Respondent, do you have
questions?
RESPONDENT:
9
10
I don't think we have anything to
play it on since I don't have a laptop.
6
7
Do you have anything to play it
Yes, Your Honor.
CROSS EXAMINATION
BY RESPONDENT:
11
Were you close friends?
12
With Complainant?
13
Yeah.
14
Yes.
15
Did she explain to you why she tweeted out an
16
17
outcry instead of calling or texting you?

A
I mean, in that situation you probably don't
18
know who to call, your brain is very scattered.
19
think she was just kind of crying out for help from
20
anybody, and I just happened to be awake at that hour
21
and able to respond to her.
22
But you were close friends, right?
23
What?
24
You guys were close friends?
25
Yes.
So I
88
Okay.
I would say maybe a little before 3:00.
3
4
5
6
What time was that tweet?
not positive.
Q
Did you know about her boyfriend, Jamal, on
December 6th of 2012?

A
Yes.
RESPONDENT:
JUSTICE HARDING:
MR. CORNWELL:
Okay.
JUSTICE HARDING:
11
MS. BUKANC:
13
JUSTICE HARDING:
15
COMPLAINANT:
16
JUSTICE HARDING:
You may be excused.
18
WITNESS THREE:
19
JUSTICE HARDING:
23
24
25
Complainant, do you have
No, Your Honor.
17
22
Anything else?
has anything.
anything further?
21
Very fine.
You can ask Complainant if she
14
20
Is that all?
Yes.
10
12
I'm
Okay.
Appreciate your being here.

Thank you.
Now, Robyn, I just have the
next witness has been scheduled for in the morning.

MS. JACKSON:
Yes, sir.
Those are all of our
witnesses for today.

JUSTICE HARDING:
the morning.
We will reconvene at 9:00 in
Is that agreeable?
MS. EGAN:
Yes, sir.
89
1
2
MS. BUKANC:
I don't know if we want to just
talk briefly --
JUSTICE HARDING:
We're off the record.
(The proceedings were concluded at 4:46 p.m.)
5
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90
1
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HEARING CERTIFICATE
STATE OF FLORIDA
3
4
)
)SS:
COUNTY OF LEON
5
6
I, KIMBERLY S. BARTHOLOMEW, Professional Court
Reporter and Notary Public, hereby certify that I was
authorized and did stenographically report the foregoing
proceedings and that this transcript is a true record of
10
the proceedings before the Panel and Justice Harding.
11
I further certify that I am not a relative,
12
employee, attorney or counsel for any of the parties nor
13
am I a relative or employee of any of the parties;
14
attorney of counsel connected with the action, nor am I
15
financially interested in the action.
16
Dated this 4th day of December, 2014.
17
18
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20
My commission
21
expires: 2/23/18
_______________________________
KIMBERLY S. BARTHOLOMEW,
Professional Court Reporter
Notary Public, State of Florida
Notary #FF080212
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CONFIDENTIAL

FLORIDA STATE UNIVERSITY

Tuesday, December 2, 2014

Commenced at 12:20 p.m.

ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.

Justice Major Harding

ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.

GORDON & REES, LLP

ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.

Direct Examination by Justice Major Harding

Cross Examination on behalf of Respondent

Redirect Examination by Justice Major Harding

Direct Examination by Justice Major Harding

Cross Examination on behalf of Respondent

Cross Examination by Complainant

Recross Examination by Respondent

(Exhibits retained by Justice Harding)

Questions to Witness One

Questions to Witness Two

The following proceedings were had:

pleasure to meet you.

have some procedural issues that you wish to

discuss, and I'm willing to hear those at this

And I understand that you

And it would be helpful for the court reporter

and the record will accurately reflect if you would

be kind enough to state your name, Mr. Kerr, before

you speak, and Mr. Cornwell.

I'm Baine Kerr representing the

Complainant as her advisor.

were not requesting two advisors.

don't -- it's kind of -- I'm unfamiliar with the

procedures enough not to know who really is an

advisor and who isn't.

The rules are a little

different from what you learned in law school.

Our only concern was that Complainant, if I am

required to be in the hearing room, that she not be

in the satellite room alone, and just wanted the

ability to have someone with her.

Corey Pruitt is available and is there now and

perfectly acceptable for that purpose for us.

do not need another lawyer present, and certainly

not in an advisor capacity.

And what is her

She was the victim's advocate who

was assigned to Complainant and who has a

relationship that developed throughout 2013 of, you

know, supportive, emotionally, and providing

assistance of various kinds to her.

So they know each well and she has been

supportive, and Complainant has a lot of trust and

And she is a Florida State

first blush I don't think we have an objection.

this woman intends -- whether they intend to call

her as a witness; and, in that case, I think we

have some concern about her being able to hear.

Do you intend to call her as

No, she is not on our witness list.

Then we have no objection.

But maybe generally we can

address will we be invoking the Rule of

Sequestration that witnesses will not be in the

room or otherwise be hearing the testimony?