2008 FDLE Investigation of Heather Walsh-Haney

FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT
INVESTIGATIVE REPORT
On Tuesday, January 8, 2008, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement received
information in reference to the possibility of someone having unlawful possession of human
remains. The person identified as being in possession of the remains is Forensic Anthropologist
Dr. Heather Walsh-Haney. Special Agents Ronnie Austin and Mike Walsh were assigned to
follow up on this information.
Special Agents Austin and Walsh, along with Special Agent Supervisor Andrew Rose, met with
Priscilla Doyle and Karen Warren at the FDLE office in Fort Myers, on January 8th. Priscilla
Doyle and Karen Warren are the persons identified as bringing this information forward.
Priscilla Doyle and Karen Warren are students at Florida Gulf Coast University (FGCU). Dr.
Heather Walsh-Haney is an associate professor at FGCU. Doyle and Warren volunteered their
time to help Walsh-Haney with her work of identifying the human remains of unidentified
persons. In October of 2007, Doyle and Warren went to the District 20 Medical Examiners
Office in Collier County to complete some of their volunteer work. All the unidentified human
remains for Walsh-Haneys project are kept at this facility. Their work consisted of going
through the boxes of unidentified remains and getting them ready to be shipped to the
University of North Texas, where DNA work would be completed.
During their work, Doyle and Warren came across two cases where the remains were those of
identified persons. Upon examining the documentation further, they discovered the following.
The first case was identified as the remains of Frankie Deangelo Dennard. Dennard was the
victim of a homicide and his body was found on February 16, 2002, in Jacksonville, Florida.
The remains in this case consisted of the skull and fragments, along with cervical vertebrae,
C1-C7. A receipt for evidence, labeled as being from the Medical Examiners Office in
Jacksonville, shows these remains being received by Walsh-Haney on August 4, 2005. The
second case was identified as the remains of Jeffrey Ivan Gwyn, Jr. Gwyn was a victim of a
homicide and his body was found on March 30, 2002, in Jacksonville, Florida. The remains in
this case consisted of the humeri (upper arm) and femurs (upper leg), along with cervical
vertebrae, C1-C4 and some fragments. A receipt for evidence in this case, also labeled as
being from the Medical Examiners Office in Jacksonville, also shows Walsh-Haney as receiving
these remains on August 4, 2005.
Doyle and Warren were unsure of what to do with these remains, since there were already
identified, so they asked Walsh-Haney about them. Walsh-Haney told them those cases were
donated to her. When they tried to inquire further about these two cases, because there was
no paperwork showing the remains were donated, Walsh-Haney told them to get their work
Case Number:FM-73-0762
Serial #:1
Author:Austin, Ronald W
Office:Ft. Myers
Activity Start Date:01/08/2008
Activity End Date:02/20/2008
Approved By:Rose, Andrew
Description:Initial IR
THIS REPORT IS INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF THE AGENCY TO WHICH IT WAS
DISSEMINATED AND MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS EITHER PRIVILEGED OR
CONFIDENTIAL AND EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE UNDER APPLICABLE LAW. ITS
CONTENTS ARE NOT TO BE DISTRIBUTED OUTSIDE YOUR AGENCY.
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Case Number: FM-73-0762

IR Number: 1
completed and leave, never giving them an answer.
Doyle and Warren became concerned about this, because Walsh-Haneys demeanor towards
them completely changed when they asked her about these cases. They were also concerned
that the families of these two men possibly did not know they did not bury the entire remains.
Warren made contact with Dr. Duane Dobbert at FGCU, who is in the Division of Justice
Studies at FGCU. Warren told Dr. Dobbert of what they found and what Walsh-Haney told
them and how she acted. Dr. Dobbert referred her to the University Ombudsman, Dr. Charles
McKinney. Warren and Doyle met with Dr. McKinney and conveyed the same information to
him. Dr. McKinney told them he would look into the matter. Meanwhile, Walsh-Haney called
Warren and told her that she was to cease all her work and would not be assisting her with her
classes (Warren had been acting as a graduate assistant to Walsh-Haney).
Warren and Doyle became more curious about the case and began to conduct their own
research. On their own, they ordered a copy of the death certificates of Dennard and Gwyn.
Dennards death certificate indicates he was buried at Restlawn Memorial Park in Jacksonville,
Florida. Gwyns death certificate indicates he was buried at Magnolia Garden in Savannah,
Georgia.
Warren and Doyle again met with Dr. McKinney (FGCU Ombudsman) and told them of what
they found from the copies of the death certificates. Dr. McKinney again stated he was looking
into the matter.
When they felt like nothing was being done, they contacted Brett Harding at the Medical
Examiners Office in Lee County, who suggested they speak with FDLE.
On Thursday, January 10, 2008, recorded sworn statements were taken from Doyle and
Warren at FDLE by Special Agents Austin and Walsh. These statements are being retained as
related items.
In addition to her statement regarding the cases from Jacksonville, Priscilla Doyle also provided
a statement in reference to Dr. Walsh-Haney being in possession of Native American remains.
Priscilla Doyle became suspicious about these remains and was concerned that Dr.
Walsh-Haney didnt have the appropriate authority to be in possession of these remains. The
reason she thought this, is that during the spring semester of 2007, she assisted Dr.
Walsh-Haney in setting up an exhibit of human remains for the media at FGCU, after the eight
skeletons were found in Fort Myers. During the process of setting up this exhibit, Dr.
Walsh-Haney told Priscilla the remains were Native American, but told Doyle not to mention this
to anyone. She didnt think anything of this and dismissed the comment at the time. Priscilla
Doyle further stated that at the end of the fall semester of 2007, a fellow student, Tina Boyce,
spoke about helping Dr. Walsh-Haney clean remains that were Native American. When she
asked Tina Boyce about these remains and where they were from, Boyce stated they were from
a site somewhere off of I-75.
On Tuesday, January 15, 2008, Special Agents Ronnie Austin and Mike Walsh met with Brett
Harding at the Medical Examiners Office in Fort Myers. Brett Harding provided information on
two cases in which Dr. Walsh-Haney made questionable statements in her official reports,
regarding her potentially taking possession of human remains from the Medical Examiners
Office.
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The first case, M.E. case #06-00730, was reported to the Medical Examiners Office on
September 8, 2006. In this case, human remains were found in a box by the owner of a
residence. The remains consisted of a cranium, mandible, and cervical, thoracic and lumbar
vertebrae. Dr. Walsh-Haney completed an osteological examination and wrote a report on her
findings, determining the remains to in fact be human. At the end of her report, she states
these remains will be curated within the HWH skeletal collection at Florida Gulf Coast
University. Her report became part of the Medical Examiners case file when she turned it in,
possibly making it a public record. The report is dated October 27, 2006. Brett Harding stated
that Dr. Walsh-Haney does not have the authority to curate the remains to her collection.
The second case, M.E. case #07-00615, was reported to the Medical Examiners Office on
August 9, 2007. In this case, a human cranium and mandible were found in a cast-iron pot,
which was determined to be part of a Palo Mayombe religious shrine. Dr. Walsh-Haney
completed an osteological examination and wrote a report on her findings, determining the
remains to in fact be human. At the end of her report, Dr. Walsh-Haney states Lee County
Sheriffs Office has donated these specimens to me for teaching purposes. This report also
became part of the Medical Examiners case file when she turned it in, possibly making it a
public record. The report is dated November 2, 2007. Brett Harding stated that Lee County
Sheriffs Office does not have the authority to turn the items over to Dr. Walsh-Haney.
These two cases (remains) are still in custody of the District 21 Medical Examiner, Dr. Rebecca
Hamilton, in Fort Myers, Florida. The original reports authored by Dr. Walsh-Haney are also in
possession of the Medical Examiners Office.
SA Austin made contact with Detective William Murphy of the Lee County Sheriffs Office.
Detective Murphy was the lead investigator on the first case (M.E. case #06-00730). Detective
Murphy was asked if he ever told or led Dr. Walsh-Haney to believe that she could have
possession of the human remains from this case. Detective Murphy stated that he did not give
permission to anyone granting release of these remains. Detective Murphy provided a written
sworn affidavit to this effect, which will be maintained as a related item.
SA Austin also made contact with Detective Bill Kalstrom of the Lee County Sheriffs Office.
Detective Kalstrom was the lead investigator on the second case (M.E. case #07-00615).
Detective Kalstrom was asked if he ever told Dr. Walsh-Haney that she could take possession
of the human remains from this case. Detective Kalstrom stated that he did not tell Dr.
Walsh-Haney that she could take possession of these remains, nor does he have the authority
to do so. Detective Kalstrom provided a written sworn affidavit to this effect, which will be
maintained as a related item.
On Wednesday, January 16, 2008, Special Agents Austin and Walsh met with Dr. Marta
Coburn, Chief Medical Examiner for District 20 in Naples, Florida. The two Jacksonville cases
were still secured in the Medical Examiners evidence room, sealed with evidence tape. Dr.
Coburn stated that Dr. Walsh-Haney has numerous cases of unidentified human remains
stored at the District 20 facility, where she conducts her work. Dr. Coburn also stated that Dr.
Walsh-Haney is a consultant for District 20 and maintains a working office at the facility. Dr.
Coburn states that she does not have any reason to believe that Dr. Walsh-Haney has
intentionally done anything wrong regarding the Jacksonville cases.
On Thursday, January 17, 2008, Special Agent Austin made contact with Jeff Brokaw, Chief
Investigator for the District 4 Medical Examiners Officer in Jacksonville, Florida. SA Austin
explained the information that was provided by Doyle and Warren. SA Austin requested that
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Brokaw check these two cases to determine if Heather Walsh-Haney had permission to be in
possession of these remains and to provide documentation showing this.
Jeff Brokaw told SA Austin that after he reviewed the two files, he confirmed that the remains
from the two cases in question (Dennard & Gwyn) were in fact turned over to/released to
Heather Walsh-Haney on August 4, 2005.
Jeff Brokaw further stated that Heather
Walsh-Haney has 30-40 cases of human remains that belong to District 4, with their
permission. Jeff Brokaw explained that they did not have room for these cases, as they were
all unidentified cases, so they have allowed Heather Walsh-Haney to be in possession of them.
Jeff Brokaw faxed SA Austin documentation on the Dennard and Gwyn cases. In the Dennard
case, one document is a follow up investigation report from Investigator Moore, documenting
that his (Dennard) family did not want to collect the portion of the remains that were not already
interred. The two other documents from each case is the evidence list showing the remains
were released to Heather Walsh-Haney. These documents will be retained as a related item.
On Friday, January 18, 2008, Special Agents Austin and Walsh interviewed Dr. Rebecca
Hamilton, Chief Medical Examiner for District 21. Dr. Hamilton identified Dr. Walsh-Haneys
relationship/role with her office as an official consultant. Dr. Walsh-Haney has performed
numerous osteological examinations on human remains for District 21. Dr. Walsh-Haney was
not paid for her work. Dr. Hamilton has suspended Dr. Walsh-Haneys privileges for District 21
due to questions regarding her trustworthiness. Dr. Hamilton cited the two cases Brett Harding
reported to FDLE as reason to believe Dr. Walsh-Haney was being dishonest in her attempt to
take possession of human remains. Dr. Hamilton stated that Dr. Walsh-Haney does not have
the authority to take possession of human remains that are in custody of District 21, without her
(Dr. Hamilton) consent. Regarding the statements in Dr. Walsh-Haneys reports on the two
cases, the Lee County Sheriffs Office cannot give permission for Dr. Walsh-Haney to take
custody of the remains nor can Dr. Walsh-Haney curate the other remains to her private
collection.
On January 24, 2008, Special Agents Austin and Walsh met with Dr. Kenneth Millar and Dr.
Hudson Rogers of Florida Gulf Coast University regarding the information we received
concerning Dr. Walsh-Haney and the Native American remains. Dr. Rogers informed the
Agents they would be conducting an internal inquiry into the matter of the Native American
remains being kept at FGCU.
On Tuesday, January 29, 2008, Special Agents Austin and Walsh interviewed Pam Strassel, an
Investigator with the District 21 Medical Examiners Office. Strassel was the Investigator
assigned to the two cases in which Dr. Walsh-Haney made questionable statements regarding
taking possession of the remains. Strassel stated she did not tell Dr. Walsh-Haney she could
take possession of the remains from these two cases, nor does she have the authority to do so.
Strassels statement will be maintained as a related item.
On Thursday, January 31, 2008, SA Austin spoke with Dr. Margarita Arruza, Chief Medical
Examiner for District 4. Dr. Arruza confirmed and authenticated the information that was sent to
SA Austin regarding Heather Walsh-Haney being in possession of the Dennard and Gwyn
remains. Dr. Arruza told SA Austin that Heather Walsh-Haney has permission/authority to be in
possession of these remains, as well as other cases from her district.
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On Tuesday, February 5, 2008, Dr. Rogers contacted SA Austin regarding the Native American
remains. Dr. Rogers informed SA Austin that the Chief State Archeologist, Dr. Ryan Wheeler,
informed FGCU, through an email, that Dr. Walsh-Haney has permission from his office
(Bureau of Archeological Research) to be in possession of these Native American remains.
These particular remains are property of the Bureau of Archaeological Research and were from
a find in 1987. The email was forwarded to SA Austin and will be retained as a related item.
On Friday, February 8, 2008, a meeting was held at the State Attorneys Office to
present/discuss the findings of this investigation and more specifically, determine if the
statements made by Dr. Walsh-Haney in her reports rise to the level of being criminal as it
relates to official misconduct. Attending this meeting were ASA Dean Plattner, Chief
Investigator Kevin Smith, Special Agents Austin and Walsh and SAS Andrew Rose. ASA
Plattner took the matter under advisement, stating he wanted to review the matter in more
detail.
On Thursday, February 14, 2008, ASA Dean Plattner contacted SA Austin. ASA Plattner
advised SA Austin that after reviewing the information provided regarding Dr. Walsh-Haney and
the reports she made false statements in, he does not see where criminal intent is evident.
ASA Plattner stated he did want to be updated on any statements made by Dr. Walsh-Haney
after she is interviewed by FDLE.
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The following investigative report details the investigation into forensic anthropologist Heather
Walsh-Haney.
On March 17, 2008, Special Agent (SA) Michael Walsh received a phone call from District 21
Medical Examiner Dr. Rebecca Hamilton concerning Heather Walsh-Haney.
Dr. Hamilton stated that on March 13, 2008, the Glades County Sheriffs Office responded to a
landfill area in Moore Haven, Fl (Off of US 27) in where construction workers dug up human
remains. Detective Steve Harris of the GCSO was assigned as the lead investigator of the
case.
A GCSO Captain called Walsh-Haney directly to assist in the investigation. The remains were
brought to the GCSO. Walsh-Haney responded to the office with two Florida Gulf Coast
University (FGCU) students and began a preliminary investigation (taking photographs and
measurements). Walsh-Haney asked GCSO if they had called the District 21 Medical Examiner
to report the incident. GCSO stated they had not informed the Medical Examiner (ME).
Walsh-Haney told GCSO that they should call the ME to report the incident.
Walsh-Haney then asked GCSO if they wanted her to take the remains to the ME and GCSO
stated that ME Investigator Brett Harding would take possession of the remains.
Walsh-Haney then marked the skull with her case number using an indelible marker and left the
office.
Dr. Hamilton stated she wanted to make SA Walsh aware of this incident.
Serial #:2
Author:Walsh, Michael
Office:Ft. Myers
Description:Moore Haven remains discovered.
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The following investigative report details the interviews conducted concerning the remains of
Jeffrey Gwyn.
On March 28, 2008, Special Agent (SA) Michael Walsh contacted Jeffrey Bass of Atlanta,
Georgia. Bass is the uncle of Jeffrey Gwyn, a homicide victim from Jacksonville, Florida. Jeffrey
Gwyn was murdered on March 30, 2002.
SA Walsh spoke to Bass at length and asked him if he knew that there were currently remains
of his nephew Jeffrey Gwyn in the Collier County, Florida Medical Examiners Office. Bass
stated that he was aware of the information and was very disturbed by the news. Bass stated
that his family (including Kimberly Gwyn Jeffrey Gwyns mother and next of kin) were never
informed that the police had ever found remains of Jeffrey Gwyn. Bass also stated that his
family had been contacted previously by a reporter with the news of Jeffrey Gwyn.
SA Walsh asked Bass if Kimberly Gwyn or any other family member had ever signed any
document donating any remains of Jeffrey Gwyn to the Medical Examiners office and Bass
emphatically stated, No. Bass went on to say that it was his familys intentions that if the police
had ever found partial remains of Jeffrey Gwyn, that the family would exhume the coffin and
place the remains inside to bury Jeffrey Gwyn whole.
SA Walsh asked Bass if Kimberly Gwyn would speak to him regarding this matter and Bass
stated that Kimberly Gwyn was consulting an attorney and would not speak to law enforcement.
On April 2, 2008, Special Agent (SA) Michael Walsh spoke via phone to Jeff Brokaw, Chief
Medical Investigator of the Office of District 4 Medical Examiner in Jacksonville, Florida.
SA Walsh was inquiring about a homicide victim named Jeffrey Gwyn whose remains were
currently being stored in the District 20 Medical Examiners Office in Collier County, Florida.
SA Walsh was referencing Jacksonville ME report # 02-0441.
SA Walsh asked Brokaw to check the file he had on Gwyn to see if he could locate any
paperwork in reference to the next of kin of Gwyn authorizing the donation of the remains of
Gwyn to the Medical Examiners office. Brokaw checked the file he had and could not locate
any such paperwork.
Serial #:3
Office:Ft. Myers
Description:Bass & Brokaw interviews.
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The following investigative report is in reference to the interview with Dr. Heather Walsh-Haney
which was conducted on April 4, 2007.
The voluntary sworn taped interview of Dr. Walsh-Haney was conducted by Special Agent (SA)
Michael Walsh and Special Agent Supervisor (SAS) Andrew Rose at the law offices of Quarles
and Brady in Naples, Florida. Dr. Walsh-Haney was represented by attorneys Michael DOnofrio
and Kenneth Haney (also the husband of Dr. Walsh-Haney).
The transcript of Walsh-Haneys statement can be found below:
Florida Department of Law Enforcement
Case Number FM-73-0762
Interview of Heather Walsh-Haney, Part 1, 04/04/08
MW:
AR:
MD:
HWH:
KH:
Mike Walsh, Special Agent, Florida Department of Law Enforcement

Andrew Rose, Special Agent Supervisor, Florida Department of Law Enforcement
Michael DOnofrio, Attorney
Heather Walsh-Haney
Kenneth Haney, Attorney (husband of Heather Walsh-Haney)
MW:
Okay. Todays date is April 4th, 2008. Time is 9:12 am. This is Special Agent Mike
Walsh with FDLE. Also present for this interview is Special Agent Supervisor Andrew
Rose, uh, attorney Michael DOnofrio. Last names spelled DO-n-o-f-r-i-o. A white
maleuh, white female, Heather Walsh-Haney, and uh, attorney Kenneth Haney whos
also Heathers husband. Uh, were currently at the law offices of Quarles and Brady
which is located at 1395 Panther Lane, Suite 300, in Naples, Florida. Um, this interview
is gonna be concerning FDLE case number FM-73-0762. Uh, Heather can you do me a
favor and raise yourcan I call you Heather
HWH: Its alright.

MW:
or Doctor, whatever you want.
HWH: Yes. Of course

MW:
Okay.
Serial #:4
Office:Ft. Myers
Description:Interview of Dr. Walsh-Haney.
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HWH: you can call me by that.

MW:
Do me a favor
MD:
Mike. Youre gonna swear her in?
MW:
Yeah.
MD:
What authority do you have to swear her in?
AR:
(laugh) As a notaryas, as an agent, as a law enforcement officer in the state of

Florida, we have the right under state statue as Im sure you know to
MD:
Is that right?
AR:
swear people in. Absolutely, take sworn statements all the time. As part of our job.
MD:
What, which statue is that?
AR:
One seventeen, I believe. If you want to look that up.
MD:
So you have the right to swear her in for testimony?
AR:
Yes.
MD:
Okay.
AR:
All, all day long (laughing).
MD:
Okay.
AR:
Done it for almost twenty years now, so.
MW:
Alright.
MD:
Im sorry.
MW:
Heather, raise you hand. Thank you. Do you swear, affirm the testimony, testimony
youre about to give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothin but the truth, so help you
God?
HWH: I do.
MW:
Okay. Great. Thanks. Okay. Uh, Heather as you know, I can call you Heather
HWH: Yes.
MW:
were good? Alright. Alright, as you know um, a couple students from FGCU uh,
brought thisthis how FDLE got involved. Okay? Um, they were um, Priscilla Doyle and
Karen Warren. Uh, they were students of yours? Uh, let me get this out of the way. How
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are you employed?
HWH: Oh, yes. I am a professor at Florida Gulf Coast University.
MW:
And thats in Estero?
HWH: That is in Fort Myers actually.

MW:
Is it Fort Myers?
HWH: Um-hum.
MW:
Okay. And your expertise is in
HWH: My expertise is in physical anthropology and forensic anthropology.

MW:
Alright so teacher hunshundreds of students a year.
HWH: I do.
MW:
Right. Okay. And as a professor, a doctor, um, you have many students that volunteer
their time, work for you on different cases and all that?
HWH: Lets see

MW:
Alright. Youif you can explain it, explain it better cause
HWH: Um, I have graduate students and a select few undergraduates who volunteer with me
and they will become involved in cases through my consulting as a service component
at Florida Gulf Coast University.
MW:
Right. Okay. And youre also a consultant for District 21?
HWH: Actually
MW:
Uh, prior.
HWH: Prior, yes.

MW:
Right.
HWH: Yeah.
MW:
For Rebecca Hamilton and Marta Coburn down here, consultant with her?
HWH: Yes.
MW:
And thats District 20?
HWH: Um-hum.
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MW:
Okay. Itis there anywhere else youre a consultant, like statewide or
HWH: Yes.
MW:
Okay.
HWH: Um, I am a consultant for District 4 in Jacksonville, District 17 in Broward. Previously I

was a consultant for District 5. On occasion I have also been, uh, consultant for West
Palm for (unintelligible).
MW:
Wow. Okay. Okay and uh, bein a statewide consultant for finding human remains and
all that, like you said, you have students that volunteer. If they find remains uh, you call
up the students in the middle of the night and say Hey, lets go. We got. I mean how
does that work?
HWH: I do it the same way I was trained.

MW:
Uh-hu.
HWH: And that is that um, if there is a case and Ive given enough notice from the investigating
agencies I will call my graduate students or a select few undergrads and theyll come
with me.
MW:
Okay. Great. Great. Um, okay. Now to get back to Heum, Priscilla and Karen were
two of your students that worked with you closely and came out on different scenes
and
HWH: Um, yes.

MW:
Okay. And they uh, they also went down to the District 20 medical examiner helpin you
with the, on aunidentified remains?
HWH: Um
MW:
What were they doin down there?
KH:
If I can say
MW:
Uh-hu.
KH:
Heather, break down the question because itsaying unidentified remains
MW:
Is there a pro
KH:
(unintelligible)
MW:
is there a national project? Like, were they helping you with a national project is out of
Texas or somethin?
HWH: Well
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MW:
No, wait a minute.
AR:
I guess what did they do? What was their job? What were those
HWH: Well they didnt really have a

AR:
when youre at the M.E.s office here in Collier.
HWH: Um, the purpose of them being there was to be mentored by me so that they could help
learn what a forensic anthropologist does. And then um, out of that came the
opportunity for them to help um, with I guess looking at skeletal remains.
MW:
Um-hum.
HWH: Specifically that came from the Jacksonville office of the medical examiner.
MW:
Right.
KH:
But I, I would just say hes probably, just tryin to make itits probably best for you to
describe the project that you gave to Priscilla.
HWH: Okay.
KH:
What the context of that was and how Karen became involved.
HWH: Specifically I had asked Priscilla Doyle um, to help me in the organization of the
Jacksonville medical examiner cases because I knew within those cases there were
unknown individuals.
MW:
Right.
HWH: As so as Pricilla has had a background check conducted by Fort Myers P.D. and so she
would be
MW:
Oh.
HWH: or I guess criminal history check or something?

MW:
On herself?
HWH: Uh-hu.
MW:
Okay. Okay.
HWH: Yeah. And so I had asked her to help with that project. I gave her specific training that
would allow her to know how to properly open the boxes, show me whats inside, and
then I would help her um, to figure out the type of bone that would be suitable for DNA
analysis.
MW:
Right.
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HWH: So then the bone could be submitted to the University of North Texas
MW:
North Texas.
HWH: where DNA analysis would be done. And then um, thehopefully it would establish a
positive I.D.
MW:
Uh, good. Okay. Thatsand, and how many, how many remains of individuals from
Jacksonville do you think are down here in Collier, that were for this project?
HWH: I hesitate to give a number.

MW:
Okay.
HWH: I dont, I dont know exactly off the top of my head. I can certainly find that information
out for you.
MW:
I was just wondering if you knew. Thats the only thing. Okay. Go ahead
KH:
And you might want to give a brief explanation of where, how the, the, the remains were
transferred.
HWH: Um, the Jacksonville office of the medical examiner transferred um, the remains to
District 20 because uh, Dr Marta Coburn had invited me to come down, work out of her
office
MW:
Um-hum.
HWH: and to help her and the state really um, kinda understand the unknowns, the bones
that have been kept as part of evidence in trials, as um, bones that um, had gone
unclaimed by family.
MW:
Right.
HWH: And um, so Marta had discussed with a Dr Arruza her excitement about having me
come down to District 20
MW:
Yeah.
HWH: and that facilitated actually Dr Arruza approaching me and saying we have all these
skeletons in a storage room, a storage room that is not the proper size or humidity
MW:
Right.
HWH: to hold them.

MW:
Um-hum.
HWH: So we know about this opportunity for you in District 20. We would like you to transfer
those remains to District 20 and for you and your students to go through them, clean
them properly, store them the way you know how
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MW:
Um-hum.
HWH: and um, help us facilitate the I.D.s of those that, you know, that are unknown and to
also pinpoint remains that have been left as part of evidentiary processes from the early
70s, 80s, and 90s. And um, figure out if they need to be returned to families or if
theyre um, remains that can, other science can be done on them to help either identify
them or figure out the trauma that was there and maybe even help catch um, the
perpetrators of crimes that have been left unsolved.
MW:
Right.
HWH: Because part of the collection also includes positively I.D.ed victims who were victims of
horrible crimes.
MW:
Right.
HWH: And that the trauma analysis and perhaps tool mark comparisons on those victims
havent been done because of the time that the cases are tried the science wasnt there.
MW:
Right. Right. Yeah. I understand. Go ahead.
KH:
No. I was gonna say
MW:
Oh. Okay.
KH:
(unintelligible)
AR:
(unintelligible) Who pays you? I mean how do you receive compensation? Do you get
paid by the college? Do you get paid by the medical examiners offices? Both? Both
the
HWH: No actually
MD:
Paid for
AR:
For her services.
MD:
To
AR:
As a forensic anthropologist and as a consultant.
HWH: Im actually not paid by medical examiners offices. Um, I am paid by Florida Gulf Coast
University as a professor. And my services for the medical examiners fall under the
service component of my contract. But in fact, thanks to my husband andum, I have
actually spent lots of money to analyze cases for medical examiners as part of my
service component.
MW:
Um-hum.
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AR:
Sure but ultimately I guess youyoure a
KH:
Shes an employee of the Florida
AR:
Yeah.
KH:
Gulf Coast University.
AR:
An employee there but unfall under their rules, regulations, or whatever it might be. Is
that, would that make sense?
HWH: I dont, I dont know.

AR:
I mean are you governed by them rather than the medical examiners office?
HWH: I dont know how to answer that.

AR:
Okay. But I mean, its not a very clear question I guess.
KH:
Her
AR:
Youitgo ahead.
KH:
I was gonna say, her employment relationship is with Florida Gulf Coast University. The
consultant relationship she has with the medical examiners I think its a matter of law as
governed by the requests that the medical examiners made of her. She operates
pursuant to their instructions.
AR:
Perfect. Works for me. Would that be correct?
HWH: (laugh)
MW:
(laugh)
HWH: Yes.
AR:
Okay. Thank you.
MW:
Alright. Um, yeah everyone we talked to said your science is impeccable. Everyones
very impressed.
HWH: Thank you.

MW:
Okay? So, um, um, you said Dr Arruza shes the chief medical examiner? Its a woman?
Right?
HWH: Yes. Im sorry. Maggie Arruza.

MW:
I called her the other day and um, guy by the name of Jeff Brokaw, you know Jeff?
HWH: I do.
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MW:
Okay. Alright. Uh, specifically the two cases that were brought to our attention, which all
started from Priscilla and Karen are two cases um, of the remains of two, uh, young
black men, um, from the Jacksonville area, um, that their remains are here. Okay?
Youre aware of these cases?
HWH: Um-hum.
MW:
Okay. And just for the record, uh, oh wait, these are the wrong ones. Um, stand by a
second. Itsright here. And the first one, and you have copies of this? You got this last
time Mike? Okay. Uh, first one
MD:
(unintelligible)
MW:
Yeah.
AR:
Theyre some documents you guys requested the last time I guess. Before you left?
MD:
I had two reports that you gave me.
MW:
Okay.
MD:
Those are the only ones
MW:
Alright. Uh, alright if you dontif theyre not
MD:
I do, I do not have that.
MW:
Okay. Ill give you a copy of this okay?
MD:
Okay. Yeah, we havent seen that.
MW:
You want to look, its two M.E. reports from uh, from Jacksonville. Um, ones a Frankie
Dennard and the others a Jeffery Gwyn. You didnt get copies of those last time?
MD:
I did not.
MW:
Okay.
MD:
In fact I thought today
AR:
Oh, youre right.
MW:
You got copies
AR:
You did not
MW:
You got copies
AR:
you received the copies
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MW:
of these?
AR:
of these other reports.
MD:
These two reports.
AR:
Right.
MD:
But I thought today the, the only issue that was being inquired about were these two
reports
MW:
Right.
MD:
um, out of uh, District 21. I thought from our conversation that the issues related to
the Jacksonville medical examiners office had been resolved and has nothing to do with
Heather.
MW:
I just want to get it on record. Heatherhas noththese guys, uh, Mr Dennard and
Gwyn
MD:
Its fine.
MW:
we have a letter saying, right, that she, uh, Heather has nothin to do ultimately, shes
not responsible for this.
MD:
Okay.
MW:
You know so I just wanted to get it
AR:
Were just tryin to establish how they came into the possession of the medical
examiners office or you here in Collier County.
MW:
Right.
KH:
You have, do you have the chain of evidence forms that were previously provided to Mr
Austin?
MW:
Yeah, theyre right, theyre right here.
AR:
They should have them.
MW:
Its all in one packet.
KH:
But like I would say that the.
MW:
Thats, thats one.
KH:
The receipt of evidence forms would be the only (unintelligible) in terms of the medical
examiners transfer of those remains Mike.
MW:
And theres the uh

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AR:
Theres the other one.
MW:
Yeah.
MD:
Alright so whats your question?
MW:
Right. Im not tryin to trip you up or anything.
MD:
Oh, I, I dont think you are.
MW:
Im just
MD:
No, I know. Go ahead.
AR:
I guess the question is, do thosetheyre accurate. Are thoseI mean were those, uh,
were those remains transferred to ultimately I guess they all go to the medical
examiners office but through you or however that went. Its notyeah, you guys are
thinkin into it, I think, way too much.
MW:
Yeah, dontright.
MD:
What?
AR:
They ultimateyeah and were not, this is not tryin to in any way trap or trick or
anything.
MW:
No. (unintelligible)
AR:
What were tryin to do is establish how they got down here.
MW:
Right. Thats all.
MD:
How the, the remains from Dennard
AR:
And that, how those remains from uh, Jacksonville came into the possession of the
medical examiners office in Collier County. And those, theres a chain of custody form
in there.
MW:
Right.
AR:
Is, are those forms accurate for those two bodies. Or does it, they appear to be accurate
because we only have the copy.
MD:
Right. She had, she had, she did some cursory review of the documents. Whether these
are theif, if you know how the Dennard remains have made it to District 20 and the
Gwyn remains have been, uh, are now in District 20, you can explain how they got there
if you know.
HWH: Sure.
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MD:
Okay.
HWH: Um, those two sets of remains were part of the rest of the skeletal materials that were
trusted to District 20 and me to conduct the analysis so that we could figure out who was
there and what science could be done
AR:
Um-hum.
HWH: in the interest of the families involved.

MW:
Right. Yeah. Were not tryin to trip you up. Believe me.
AR:
Now that was
MW:
Believe me.
AR:
simple enough, see.
MW:
Yeah.
AR:
(laugh)
MW:
Alright. And if you, no justdid Dr Arruza give you these to you? Do you know?
HWH: Yes.
MW:
If you dont its okay. Its no big deal.
HWH: Uh, Drwell Jeff Brokaw, who is her chief investigator and Dr Maggie Arruza who is the
chief medical examiner. And she did that with support of the rest of her staff. They felt it
was an important (unintelligible).
AR:
Do you know how, how all those remains, or these particular two, and the rest of those
remains from Jacksonville, found their way down to Collier?
HWH: Oh, yeah.

AR:
Did you drive them?
HWH: I drove them down.

AR:
SomebodyI, I have no idea.
HWH: I drove them down.

AR:
Okay. Like in a car or a van or whatever it might be.
HWH: Florida Gulf Coast University paid to have a van that I rented and I drove em down.
AR:
I know.
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MW:
Its good. And, and so you know, um, this is how this whole thing started with these two
guys, when Priscilla and Karen found these two guys. They found the chain of custody
in the box. Okay? They thought somethin wasnt right. And uh, um
MD:
Well what didnt they think was right?
MW:
Well they found the chain of custody form in the box. Okay?
AR:
Actually I, I think ultimately what happened in this is, is theres two identified, two sets of
identified remains in boxes full of unidentifieds. And it just seemed odd to them. Not
saying theyit just appeared odd and I dont thinkI think thats where ultimately
everything started from so. Its not, you knowtheyre tryin to do in their eyesand Im
speaking for them and maybe I shouldnt, but somethin seemed weird, they were tryin
to do the right thing and say, Whoa, whats goin on with these. Were looking through
unidentified remains and that may be a matter of opinion but theyre looking through
unidentified remains and find two identified.
MD:
Right. They contacted the FDLE without even discussing with the doctor. Without
discussing with the university.
AR:
I dont
MD:
Soright, I, I
AR:
(unintelligible)
MD:
appreciate your opinion but I, I, I think theres more to this than, than what they may
be telling you.
AR:
But, that, and thats quite possible. Im just sayin whatmy opinion.
MW:
Alright. Um, and I, and I dont want to dwell on this. Um, we, we, Iwe contacted Jeff
and Dr Arruza and they say, okay we have these chain of custody we just want to make
sure theyre where they should be. You know? Because the death certificate on both of
em said they should be buried and not the donated boxes checked, you know.
KH:
Let me, let me interject here
MW:
Yeah.
KH:
for the record as, as a legal matter.
MW:
Uh-hu.
KH:
Um, any decision and Im sure you might be aware of this, but any decision with respect
to attention of uh, the remains themselves, body parts, uh, tissue samples, organs, uh,
all as governed by (unintelligible) of the Florida Administrative code is the, is the sole
decision of the, and at the discretion of the medical examiner.
MW:
Right.
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IR Number: 4
KH:
Heather has no participation
MW:
Right.
KH:
in that determination. Um, whether or not uh, the families were entitled or required to
receive notification of the tissue specimens that the Jacksonville medical examiner
retained um, is, is an open issue.
MW:
Right.
KH:
Thisbut that is all under the medical examiners purview.
MW:
Right.
KH:
So I, I say that to the extent that I, Im am gonna askand I dont know if youre going
there but before we do if any question regarding what the medical examiner decided
arentIm lookin at it that Heathers not gonna answer those. Its not her privy. She
doesnt know. Shes not privy or party to that decision.
MW:
Right. I guess, ultimately I guess my question, as far as you know, um, these bodies
were donated, these parts, these remains were donated for uh, teaching purposes, as
far as you know.
HWH: No.
MW:
You have no idea?
HWH: No thats an incorrect statement.

MW:
Oh. Howokay.
AR:
Then, I guess, what were tryin to findwhat, and this is not accusatory in any way,
shape, or form, and this isbut what are you doing with these, these remains? Or, what
were they going to be used for?
HWH: As I
AR:
If theyre sittin in with a bunch of unidentifieds.
HWH: As I mentioned before, um, these remains were part of a storage room that was um,
holding all of the skeletal remains cases in Jacksonville. The storage room was
overburdened, it was overcrowded, it didnt have the right humidity levels. And um,
these were cases that had been collected during the entire um, working of the medical
examiners office. So what Dr Arruza and her chief investigator did was take all of the
skeletal remains, be they positively I.D.ed pieces that had trauma on them from
homicide trials were the pieces were held for evidence.
MW:
Um-hum.
HWH: Or they were um, unidentified individuals or they were anatomical specimens that were
part of medical schools. All of those remains, in total, were delivered by me to the
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IR Number: 4
District 20 office of the medical examiner, where all of those boxes could be opened,
they could be evaluated, new reports could be generated. And the information that I
pulled from the, from those skeletized remains, Maggie and Dr Coburn and I would sit
down and decide on how we could handle the ultimate disposition of the remains. Be it
they finally were positively I.D.ed by University of North Texas. Be it that there was C-14
dating done on them so they were determined that they were not of forensic significance
and needed to be remanded to the state archeologist. Be it that now science could be
evaluated on sharp force trauma or blunt force trauma so that those wounds could be
matched to a weapons
MW:
Um-hum.
HWH: so that perpetrators could be caught, that is why I had all of those skeletized remains
in boxes inside the District 20 office of the medical examiners office.
MW:
Okay.
AR:
Thats fair enough. I, I guess wenobodys accusing you of any wrong doing with
these
MW:
With
AR:
with these remains.
MW:
No.
AR:
What happened was, this is where, we get involved originally, we have to explain not
only what, you know howget your explanation and everybody elses explanation of
how they came to be, and also say look, there was no wrong doing on your part in this.
Nobody, this is definitely, were not accusing you of any wrong doing with, with these
remains or anything. Were just tryin to figure out number one where they came from,
what theyre doing there, what you do with them, and you know, and thats it. I mean
itsso as far as that goes I mean just, were just tryin to lay the ground work as far
aspoint one, asked and answered. You know, next, then well move on and, and work
our way through it.
MD:
And, and the final question on this point ought to be Where are the remains now and
what are you doing with them if anything?.
AR:
That sounds good. (laughing)
HWH: The remains right now are still in the District 20 office of the medical examiner, as with
all the other boxes. Theyre sealed with evidence tape. And indeed because of all of this,
my work has been so slowed down that nothing has been done with those remains.
KH:
Also, I want to make you guys aware that the information that was being collected at
Heathers direction with respect to the inventorying of those boxes, was uh, originally,
well it was collected by Karen and Priscilla. They have taken the information that was
collected, which was the sole record with regard to what specimens were sanctioned to
be sent to University of North Texas and when they were sent and all of that stuff. And
they have refused despite repeated requests to return that information to Heather and
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IR Number: 4
the medical examiner. So that we are left with the position now because these two
students have stolen that information that Heather has to try and recreate through the
University of North Texas and hope that they kept good records on their end
MW:
Um-hum.
KH:
to try and determine what was done on her end because the students have refused to
return that material.
MW:
Um-hum. All the research they did they kept? Basically
KH:
It wasnt research.
HWH: It was
KH:
These materials
HWH: It was not research. (laugh)

KH:
These materials were never used for research. They were never used for teaching. And
you can ask her that question to get her direct testimony in that. But the reality is is that
these students were collecting inventory information. It wasnt research it was
documentation basically continuation of the chain of the evidence for the sections that
were taken. They collected that. They put it into a form that Heather ultimately approved.
And in the letter to President Bradshall that was referenced in the article that Im sure
you read
MW:
Um-hum.
KH:
the indication was that she prepared it on her computer so its her information and she
has refused to return it. That is significantly impairing her ability to perform the task that
the medical examiner in District 4 requested her to perform. And, you know, theres
obviously as Mike said theres, theres far more to these students involving what their
motivations were than that. But that is an important issue I want it on the record. Those
students need to be made to return that information to the medical examiner because
its impeding the ability of the medical examiner to do their job and Heather to be able to
consult (unintelligible).
MW:
Okay. Well look into that. Alright. Um, okay. Lets, lets get to these two. Um, and you,
you do have copies of these?
MD:
Yes.
MW:
Mike?
MD:
We do.
MW:
Okay. And were referencing District 21 M.E. case number 00730 and 00615. Uh, you
want to take a look at these?
(unintelligible)
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MD:
Can I have two minutes?
AR:
Sure.
MD:
Just to talk withI, cause Ive never seen these reports.
AR:
Yeah, um, I dont know whatwhich one of thesemay I take a quick look and see
what...Thanks. Oh, okay. The uh
MD:
Yeah. Weve never seen those before.
AR:
Sheriffs office. These are just uh, uh, statements by the Sheriffs Office of what
your
MD:
Yeah. I just want to ask her a couple of questions about it. Thats all.
AR:
Absolutely. Come on.
MD:
Can I just take those?
AR:
Well if we can just hang on to em in here for right now. Youre just
MD:
Alright, yeah.
AR:
I, I just want to take a look at somethin really quick. What time is it? Its uh, nine
MW:
Nine
AR:
Approximately what 9:38?
MW:
Right. Yeah.
(unintelligible whispering)
MD:
Thanks. Sorry. Were back.
AR:
Okay. Its fine.
MW:
We all set?
AR:
Yep.
MW:
Okay. Um
Florida Department of Law Enforcement

Case Number FM-73-0762
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IR Number: 4
Interview of Heather Walsh-Haney, Part 2, 04/04/08
MW:
AR:
MD:
HWH:
KH:
Mike Walsh, Special Agent, Florida Department of Law Enforcement

Andrew Rose, Special Agent Supervisor, Florida Department of Law Enforcement
Michael DOnonfrio, Attorney
Heather Walsh-Haney
Kenneth Haney, Attorney (husband of Heather Walsh-Haney)
AR:
Thats exactly. I assume HWH is Heather Walsh Haney. I could be incorrect.
HWH: Youre right.

AR:
Okay. But I, Iso, I dont want to put words in your mouth, please. I mean Im notits
not a (unintelligible)
HWH: (unintelligible)
AR:
Im not bright enough to trip anybody up soHWH would be the Heather

WalshHeather Walsh-Haney and then collection but what, again I mean itsyou lost
me for one secondwhat are those items again?
HWH: Those items consist of non-human remains. They consist of um, store bought
specimens. They consist of remains that have been donated to me by next of kin and I
guess thats it then, isnt it?
AR:
And, and non-human remains. You go to a scene, they dig up some type of skeleton, it
turns out to be a dog or something like that.
HWH: I have
AR:
Teaching purposes andIm sureI, Ive done those myself. Ive had an occasion
where I went out to a scene and we dug for a day and it turns out that its a dog, so.
HWH: I run into many incidences where law enforcement, whether police or sheriffs office or
state run into um, non-human remains and they constantly
AR:
Sure.
HWH: bringing things to me.

AR:
Okay. And then store bought specimens or uh, was that the correct term? Store bought?
HWH: Um-hum.
AR:
Okay. You canI understand there is a, you know, a way to, for people to buy human
remains, or buy maybe skulls or things like that. Is that
HWH: There are. Um, you can, one can buy human remains from biological supply houses.
From everything from Carolina Biological Supply to um, The Maxilla and Mandible in
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IR Number: 4
New York. And um, you know, people will donate their bodies for future use.
AR:
And, just out of curiosity, do, do they come, and I dont even know if I, I could have, I
have no idea if this is possible, do they often come from other countries or are they, are
they domestic (laugh) bones if you will.
HWH: Honey thats such a hard question to answer because theres so much expensive
science that would have to go on to figure out if they came from other countries. But um,
for the most part, I think right now, most of the remains are coming from the United
States, within the United States.
AR:
I mean, and just as a side, I know theres some, some controversy dealing with those
that the uh, bodies collection and things like that as to whether or not they were
prisoners or
HWH: The Body Exhibit.

AR:
Right.
HWH: Yes. Exactly.

AR:
Okay.
HWH: And so its questions concerning the ethics on whether the artist should have been using
remains that the Chinese government had donated to him because they were prisoners.
And one of the things that the Chinese prison system does is when theyre put into the
prison system they give them the opportunity to donate their bodies.
MW:
Oh, really.
HWH: And so that

AR:
Thats nice.
HWH: That it
AR:
Form to sign up front.
MW:
(laughing)
HWH: Right. And so then the question ends up being, you know, is that okay to sign up in
prison.
AR:
I mean and that has (laughing) no bearing
HWH: (laughing) I know.

AR:
or relevance on this case, just curious as that I didnt know if
HWH: Yeah.
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IR Number: 4
AR:
you can legally import body parts. I have no idea. So
MD:
Of course she has no opinion if you can import em or not.
AR:
Oh yeah, sure. (laughing)
HWH: (laughing)
AR:
Not a problem. But, okay.
MW:
Alright. The second case is also from uh, District 21. An M.E. case its 00615. Reported
on 8-9-2007. And this, this is your report on it. Its on FGCU letterhead.
HWH: Um-hum.
MW:
The same thing, osteological exam. In theright. And the part that obviously um, let me
seeand this was for, lets see. A skull found on a Santeria. You remember that?
HWH: Yeah.
MW:
Yeah. Okay. And you got called out there and
HWH: I didnt actually go to the scene.

MW:
Oh youokay. They brought it back to you and you examined it?
HWH: Um-hum.
MW:
Okay. Um, and at the end of your report here, again, right above your signature it says,
LCSO has donated these specimens for you for teaching purposes. Really?
HWH: Yes.
MW:
Do you, do you know who at LCSO gave you permission?
HWH: There was a detective. His last name starts with a K.

MW:
Um-hum.
HWH: Um, I can explain his physical appearance.

MW:
Sure.
HWH: Um, hes a little chubby. Uh, brown hair. Probably in his 40s or 50s. But um, yeah, Im
pretty sure his last name starts with a K.
MW:
K? Okay. Hes one of their homicide guys
HWH: He is.
MW:
or violent crimes, or? Youd know him if you saw him again?
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IR Number: 4
HWH: Yeah. Hes a good guy.

MW:
Okay. And he said no problem. You can take it, were done with it, what ever.
HWH: No. What he had said was, that the remains could be used for teaching. That they would
be donated um, for teaching. That he would follow up with his boss. And um, I put a note
in the file about that. And then of course when and if I ever, you know decided to follow
up I would talk with the medical examiner.
MW:
Right. Okay. Are you gonna say somethin?
KH:
No. No.
MW:
(laughing)
KH:
I was but
MW:
Um
KH:
not now (laughing).
AR:
See its tough to play both roles isnt it. (laughing) Im, Im sure.
KH:
Well
AR:
Go ahead.
KH:
I, I do wanna, I want to make sure that we get out the, the questions that are relevant to
the use.
MW:
Okay.
KH:
I mean, did you at any time every take any action in furtherance of obtaining physical
possession of those remains for your skeletal collection at FGCU.
HWH: No I didnt.
KH:
And if you wanted to do that how would you have gone about doing that?
HWH: I would have reminded all the stakeholders again, the sheriffs office, the detective, the
medical examiner, and then I wouldve uh, signed a form from the medical examiner that
would give you know final custody to me.
MD:
And where, where are those remains in these two reports today?
HWH: Those remains are at the District 21 office of the medical examiner.
MW:
Right. They are
MD:
And who has possession, custody, and control of those remains as we speak today?
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IR Number: 4
HWH: The medical examiners office.

MD:
And did everany time ever use those remains for teaching purposes?
HWH: Because of the nature of what I do I bring students with me. So when I was first
analyzing the case, yes. It ended up being used for teaching purposes. But have I used
them in the normal course of instruction, no.
MD:
But that was during your analysis
HWH: Yeah.
MD:
for the M.E.
HWH: Yeah.
MD:
So that was why you had the students there?
HWH: Yeah.
MD:
Right. But ityou didnt bring it out of the M.E.s office to the classroom.
HWH: Oh. No. No.

MD:
Right?
KH:
Last two questions that I think are important
MW:
Hum.
KH:
for you guys to know.
MW:
Okay.
KH:
The report that you wrote for Barbara Walter in 2006
HWH: Um-hum.
KH:
did you provide her with a copy of that report?
HWH: Yes.
KH:
Did she object to anything that you had written in the report at that time?
HWH: Oh no.
KH:
Same thing with Rebeccas. Did you provide her a copy of your report?
HWH: Yes.
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IR Number: 4
KH:
And did she object to anything that was written in the report at that time?
HWH: No.
MW:
Right.
KH:
If anybody is disagreeing with any of your statements in the report do you have an
explanation for why they would be disagreeing?
HWH: No.
KH:
Do you know why somebody would say that they didnt say what you said in the report?
HWH: They have a bad memory.

AR:
To follow-up on the first one though the one we talked about, the co-mingled human and
animal remains. It says though the remains will be curated with HWH skeletal collection.
Did those, and, and I know you, you probably just answered it, andwell did they ever
make it to the, did those remains ever make it to the HWH skeletal collection?
HWH: No.
AR:
So theyre still there and theyre not at FGCU?
HWH: No.
AR:
And that was in September, oh Im sorry. You dated this one 27, October of 2006. Any
reason why they never made it there?
MD:
Any reason they never made it to the HWH collection?
AR:
Um-hum. At, at FGCU.
MD:
Right.
AR:
Like the
HWH: Because I was busy with forensic cases. It wasnt that that was just a note so that as,
when things slowed down we could follow up with the medical examiner, sign the paper,
and transfer custody. But um, Ive been too busy to think about things like this.
AR:
And now, and then the next one is the second, the second case which was the
unidentified skull in the awhich ultimately inrather than Santeria be Palo Mayombe
butit says, and, and I would be, wed be negligent if we didnt ask you this. It said the
Lee County Sheriff Office has donated these specimens to me for teaching purposes.
To the best of your knowledge can the Lee County Sheriffs Office donate human
remains to anyone or would they come under authority of the medical examiners office?
HWH: Thats a hard question to answer because multiple agencies become involved in this
process. But the paragraph above my note says that these remains are not of forensic
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IR Number: 4
significance. That means that they are no longer a forensic case. Also in the paragraph
above I talk about how they are most likely anatomical specimens, teaching specimens.
They were specimens from people who agreed to donate their bodies to science.
AR:
Sure. Um
HWH: And thats so important but then um

AR:
ThatIm, I dont mean to interrupt
HWH: to continue on in answering your question

AR:
Let me just jump in really quick.
HWH: Um-hum.
AR:
We cant say that for sure that they were ever donated. I mean we have no proof that
thosealthough it appears that they could be that. That would be your opinion but there
is no written or documentation or otherwise that shows that they are.
MD:
Do you have any idea how those human remains came to be store bought specimens?
AR:
And thats in this Palo Mayombe case.
HWH: Based upon my experience at the CA pound lab, when I evaluate human remains and I
notice the taphonomic, or um, postmortem changes to be found, um, that I mentioned
in the report, that is consistent with remains that have been used in teaching. Remains
that are typically purchased. Remains, human remains that have been in the donation
system. Thats why its so important that I put on the report the remains were not of
forensic significance. Usually when theyre not of forensic significance then theyre
considered property because they do not have next of kin.
AR:
Sure.
HWH: Its been my experience at the pound lab that when these remains are considered
property that the sheriffs offices or police investigating agencies then would take um,
custody, especially of Santeria or Palo Mayombe stuff and they would keep it. And so as
a matter of course I just documented what was told to me by the detective and will be
followed up with the medical examiner.
AR:
Okay. So just, just out of curiosity thought, in a hypothetical situation you find a bone in
the woods
HWH: Um-hum.
AR:
whos to the best of your knowledge, whos property is that? Without you even looking
at it. I mean who, would that, does that not, and to, to your knowledge its that then the
jurisdiction then of the medical examiner.
HWH: Well it really depends because if its greater
Page 24
357720140422081735

IR Number: 4
AR:
If its human.
HWH: that seven to five years old its actually the property of the state archeologist.
AR:
Until, well until you find out which, if its an unidentified grave for example.
HWH: Well actually um, I know that there are archeological firms that are called out on the
scenes that police are not involved in that the medical examiners not involved in but the
human remains in therein are the immediate custody of the state archeologist.
AR:
Okay. Unfortunately though this case isnt really that. This one was of a skull, possibly
whatever else found in an iron pot. So its defits probably not gonna be an
archeological exam or a, or a case.
HWH: Its interesting that you say that because actually until C-14 dating is done on that
(unintelligible) which cost about seven hundred dollars per it actually could be a state
archeologist case.
AR:
Sure.
HWH: Based upon the morphology and taphonomy.

AR:
But until that time that those tests are done who
HWH: Thats
AR:
has jurisdiction? That would be
HWH: Well thats why they ask me for my opinion.

AR:
Sure.
HWH: And said it was not of forensic significance. And that I mentioned Asian ancestry.
AR:
And but, uh, I mean it, and bear with, bear me out on this, it appears thought that the
M.E. was called in and then at that time does not the M.E. take jurisdiction of that until
you can figure out what they are and who they are?
HWH: Yes.
AR:
Even if its a hog bone for example.
HWH: Um, actually there are times when Im called out on hog bones that the M.E. is never
involved in and in fact they dont issue a case number.
AR:
Sure. But what Im saying is before youre involved in it. I mean obviously you were
involved after the M.E.s office.
MD:
Right. I think your point is, who is she suppose to go speak to about a donation of these
remains for this particular report?
Page 25
357720140422081735

IR Number: 4
AR:
No, no, no. Im justultimately but not right at this second. What Im just tryin to find out
is whos jurisdiction would a, these bones be? Do you
HWH: I dont know.

AR:
And then you would have nobutso you dont know then if the Lee County
Sheriffand, and if we dont ask it, I mean Im not gonna know. Howdoes the Lee
County Sheriffs Office have a right to donate specimens for you for teaching purposes
in this particular case? Do you know or
HWH: I dont know.

AR:
Okay. So, but
HWH: Thats (unintelligible)

AR:
thats just a note saying thenwhat? That, just, its basically just a note for you to
remind you?
HWH: Um-hum.
AR:
Okay. Fair enough.
MW:
Okay. Go ahead.
MD:
Oh, I was gonna say is that it?
AR:
(laughing) Any other questions from you guys?
HWH: (laughing)
AR:
Anything else?
MW:
Heather you got anything you wanna, I mean
AR:
To add?
MD:
Yeah, shes (unintelligible)
HWH: I could go on forever, but no.

AR:
Well, you know, (unintelligible).
HWH: (laughing)
MD:
And we say that uh, jokingly.
AR:
Sure. You understand though what our position is. We were approached by persons on
possible allegations of, you know
MD:
Right. The two persons are

Page 26
357720140422081735

IR Number: 4
AR:
wrong doing.
MD:
Karen Warren and a Priscilla Doyle.
MW:
Are we done. Lets get this off tape.
HWH: (laughing)
KH:
Why dont you go ahead and, and take off. If you guys have a couple minutes
MD:
Yeah. We, wed like to talk off of that thing.
MW:
This is, this is gonna conclude the interview. The time is 10:01 am. Same date.
The reason why there are two parts to Dr. Walsh-Haneys statement is that SA Walshs digital
recorder stopped recording at one point and had to be shifted to a second folder to record the
rest of the statement. It is believed that there was no significant time loss between the first
recording and the second.
SA Walsh placed a copy of both portions of the above transcribed statement as well as the
CDR containing the statements into the Related Items section of this investigation.
Page 27
357720140422081735

The following investigative report details the document Special Agent (SA) Michael Walsh
received from District 5 Medical Examiner (ME) Dr. Barbara Wolf in reference to the
investigation into Heather Walsh-Haney.
On April 29, 2008, SA Michael Walsh contacted Dr. Wolf via phone concerning investigation
into Walsh Haney and specifically if she had donated Walsh-Haney any human remains for
teaching purposes for District 21 ME case # 00730. (Dr. Wolf was formally the ME for District
21 in Fort Myers, Fl).
Dr. Wolf stated that she did not under any circumstances donate any human remains to WalshHaney in reference to the case being inquired about and faxed SA Walsh a letter stipulating to
that fact.
SA Walsh placed a copy of Dr. Wolfs letter into the Related Items section of this investigation.
Serial #:5
Office:Ft. Myers
Description:Dr. Wolf fax.
Page1
357720140422081735

Case Related Items Print
Case #
Module
FM-73-0762
Administrative Log
RI Seq #
Key 1 (Case #)
Key 2 Key 3
File Name
ADL-1
FM-73-0762
HWHSummaryForSAO.doc Summary
07
Case #
Module
FM-73-0762
Investigative Report
Last Update
By
04/30/2008
13:46:22
Rose, Andrew
Last Update
Date
Last Update
By
Key 1 (Case #)
Key 2 Key 3
INV-1
FM-73-0762
Sworn Statements for Pricilla Doyle
02/20/2008
09:45:41
Austin, Ronnie
INV-2
FM-73-0762
Sworn Statement for Karen Warren
02/20/2008
09:46:36
Austin, Ronnie
INV-3
FM-73-0762
Sworn Statement for Pam Strassel
02/20/2008
09:46:59
Austin, Ronnie
INV-4
FM-73-0762
Documents Re: Jacksonville Cases
02/20/2008
09:47:44
Austin, Ronnie
INV-5
FM-73-0762
Documents Re: Fort Myers Cases
02/20/2008
09:48:06
Austin, Ronnie
INV-6
FM-73-0762
E-Mail from Dr. Ryan Wheeler
02/20/2008
09:48:53
Austin, Ronnie
INV-7
FM-73-0762
CDR + transcribed statements
04/15/2008
12:35:03
Walsh, Michael
of
Description
Last Update
Date
RI Seq #
Page
File Name
Description
04/22/2014 08.19.03

Case Related Items Print
Case #
Module
FM-73-0762
Investigative Report
RI Seq #
Key 1 (Case #)
Key 2 Key 3
INV-8
FM-73-0762
Page
of
File Name
Description
Dr. Wolf fax
Last Update
Date
Last Update
By
04/30/2008
12:58:49
Walsh, Michael
04/22/2014 08.19.03

2008 FDLE Investigation of Heather Walsh-Haney

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2008 FDLE Investigation of Heather Walsh-Haney

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FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT

Case Number: FM-73-0762

Case Number: FM-73-0762

Case Number: FM-73-0762

Case Number: FM-73-0762

FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT

FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT

Case Number: FM-73-0762

FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT

Mike Walsh, Special Agent, Florida Department of Law Enforcement

HWH: Its alright.

or Doctor, whatever you want.

HWH: Yes. Of course

Case Number: FM-73-0762

HWH: you can call me by that.

Mike. Youre gonna swear her in?

What authority do you have to swear her in?

(laugh) As a notaryas, as an agent, as a law enforcement officer in the state of

What, which statue is that?

One seventeen, I believe. If you want to look that up.

So you have the right to swear her in for testimony?

All, all day long (laughing).

Done it for almost twenty years now, so.

Case Number: FM-73-0762

And thats in Estero?

HWH: That is in Fort Myers actually.

Okay. And your expertise is in

HWH: My expertise is in physical anthropology and forensic anthropology.

Alright so teacher hunshundreds of students a year.

HWH: Lets see

Alright. Youif you can explain it, explain it better cause

Right. Okay. And youre also a consultant for District 21?

HWH: Prior, yes.

And thats District 20?

Case Number: FM-73-0762

Okay. Itis there anywhere else youre a consultant, like statewide or

HWH: Um, I am a consultant for District 4 in Jacksonville, District 17 in Broward. Previously I

HWH: I do it the same way I was trained.

HWH: Um, yes.

What were they doin down there?

Heather, break down the question because itsaying unidentified remains

Case Number: FM-73-0762

No, wait a minute.

HWH: Well they didnt really have a

when youre at the M.E.s office here in Collier.

HWH: or I guess criminal history check or something?

Case Number: FM-73-0762

HWH: I hesitate to give a number.

HWH: to hold them.

Case Number: FM-73-0762

Right. Right. Yeah. I understand. Go ahead.

No. I was gonna say

For her services.

As a forensic anthropologist and as a consultant.

Case Number: FM-73-0762

Sure but ultimately I guess youyoure a

Shes an employee of the Florida

Gulf Coast University.

HWH: I dont, I dont know.

HWH: I dont know how to answer that.

Okay. But I mean, its not a very clear question I guess.

Perfect. Works for me. Would that be correct?

Okay. Thank you.

HWH: Thank you.