Professional Documents
Culture Documents
TH
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AMENDED TRANSCRIPT
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Court Reporter:
IEN
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FR
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Phoenix, Arizona
November 12, 2015
9:07 a.m.
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No. CV 07-2513-PHX-GMS
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Gary Moll
401 W. Washington Street, SPC #38
Phoenix, Arizona 85003
(602) 322-7263
A P P E A R A N C E S
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IEN
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A P P E A R A N C E S
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IEN
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I N D E X
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Witness:
JOSEPH SOUSA
MICHAEL ZULLO
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No.
2090
2256
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2258
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FR
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4307
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Admitted
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2271
4459
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IEN
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2269
Description
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Page
E X H I B I T S
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E X H I B I T S
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No.
2274
2278
2279
2873B
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FR
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4465
4438
4439
4344
4350
2968
4360
2969A
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2964
2965
2966
2967
IEN
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DS
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2960
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Admitted
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Description
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E X H I B I T S
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No.
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2981A
2981B
2982
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IEN
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Description
Admitted
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Photograph (ZULLO_004649)
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P R O C E E D I N G S
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THE CLERK:
MS. WANG:
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THE COURT:
Good morning.
MR. YOUNG:
Stanley Young
THE COURT:
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Good morning.
MR. POCHODA:
Dan Pochoda
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THE COURT:
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Good morning.
MR. KILLEBREW:
09:07:45
Paul
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States.
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THE COURT:
Good morning.
DS
MR. MASTERSON:
John
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IEN
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THE COURT:
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MR. WALKER:
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FR
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Please be seated.
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THE COURT:
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Good morning.
Good morning, Your Honor.
Richard Walker
09:08:00
THE COURT:
Good morning.
MR. MURDY:
Craig Murdy on
Michele
THE COURT:
09:08:19
Good morning.
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THE COURT:
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I've read the motion and the response filed last evening, so I
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MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
DS
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defendants.
IEN
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MR. YOUNG:
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THE COURT:
All right.
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FR
09:08:08
Good morning.
MS. IAFRATE:
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THE COURT:
THE COURT:
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Mel McDonald
Good morning.
MR. McDONALD:
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09:08:41
MR. MASTERSON:
I got an e-mail
MS. WANG:
THE COURT:
09:09:43
Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
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It is.
MR. MASTERSON:
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THE COURT:
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09:09:51
Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
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him done then that way, we at least got one -- another witness
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down.
THE COURT:
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Yeah.
we --
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MS. WANG:
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THE COURT:
FR
09:10:00
IEN
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DS
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09:09:27
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minutes of testimony.
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His
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Sure.
-- put Mr. Zullo --
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MS. WANG:
THE COURT:
MS. WANG:
THE COURT:
Yeah.
All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
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to step outside.
THE COURT:
Okay.
Thank you.
THE COURT:
We're going to
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THE WITNESS:
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THE COURT:
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MS. WANG:
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Yes, sir.
All right.
Thank you.
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You may.
MS. WANG:
Thank you.
FR
09:11:56
JOSEPH SOUSA,
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May I hand up a
IEN
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THE COURT:
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09:11:24
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09:10:13
BY MS. WANG:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
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Q.
A.
Q.
correct?
A.
Yes, ma'am.
Q.
A.
Yes, ma'am.
Q.
deputies, correct?
A.
Yes, ma'am.
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Q.
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of deputies, correct?
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A.
Yes, ma'am.
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Q.
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correct?
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A.
Yes, ma'am.
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Q.
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BlueTeam, correct?
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A.
Yes, ma'am.
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Q.
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A.
Yes, ma'am.
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Q.
FR
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09:12:22
09:12:31
09:12:44
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09:13:09
correct?
A.
Yes, ma'am.
Q.
And that they have too many other things to make the
A.
Q.
All right.
A.
MS. WANG:
Lieutenant.
All right.
MR. WALKER:
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Thank you.
MR. MASTERSON:
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09:13:20
Yes, ma'am.
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09:13:30
I have nothing.
MR. MURDY:
THE COURT:
All right.
Thank you.
09:13:40
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MR. YOUNG:
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FR
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09:14:20
up to the Court.
IEN
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them, not through the fault the court reporters, who did a fine
and quick job with these, but just because of the nature of the
sound recordings.
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THE COURT:
I don't
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MR. MASTERSON:
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speakers are, and I'd like to know who that person is.
THE COURT:
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09:15:52
IEN
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DS
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09:15:35
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09:15:00
And in answer to
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Okay.
That is my belief.
MR. MASTERSON:
09:16:22
All right.
MICHAEL ZULLO,
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09:16:33
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BY MR. YOUNG:
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Q.
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A.
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THE COURT:
You
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Q.
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FR
09:16:48
BY MR. YOUNG:
IEN
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THE WITNESS:
DS
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09:16:40
09:17:07
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A.
Q.
evidence, but I'm going to ask you some questions based on it.
On the page that ends in nine three zero, toward the
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A.
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Q.
Did you tell Chief Knight that files on the thumb drives
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A.
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Q.
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THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
Is 2985 in
09:18:06
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it is not.
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BY MR. YOUNG:
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Q.
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That's a June 29, 2014 e-mail that Mr. Montgomery sent to you,
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correct?
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A.
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Q.
FR
09:17:53
evidence?
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A.
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to himself, correct?
A.
Q.
Anglin and others had been trying to shut the project down, is
that right?
A.
Q.
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Q.
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that right?
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A.
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Q.
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that right?
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A.
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Q.
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this way:
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IEN
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A.
FR
09:19:14
09:19:28
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09:18:59
I assert my Fifth.
MR. MASTERSON:
Objection, foundation.
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THE COURT:
Sustained.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
Q.
Did you understand from any source that Chief Sheridan did
A.
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Q.
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that right?
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Q.
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Q.
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Anglin off the case and put you back on, correct?
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A.
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Q.
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A.
DS
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09:20:51
09:21:08
IEN
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MR. YOUNG:
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motion.
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FR
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MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
I think as I indicated
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I appreciate it.
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FR
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09:21:57
That,
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about.
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09:23:21
Because
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
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Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
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I don't.
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I am.
MR. MASTERSON:
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That's my intent.
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objection.
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I'll
MR. MASTERSON:
Okay.
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THE COURT:
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FR
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09:23:59
IEN
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THE COURT:
DS
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09:24:11
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
yeah.
THE COURT:
THE COURT:
That is 2256?
MR. MASTERSON:
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Sorry, Judge.
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THE COURT:
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No, wait.
09:24:35
You're right.
Okay.
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Got you.
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Okay.
09:24:26
Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
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MR. MASTERSON:
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that we've had about what Mr. Zullo's e-mail address was.
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MR. WALKER:
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09:25:30
Thank you.
IEN
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Mr. Walker.
DS
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09:25:01
understand correctly.
So what you're looking for in the near term is
09:25:40
the document.
THE COURT:
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Yes.
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09:26:14
09:26:32
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assuming that I've drawn any up to that point relating from his
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testimony.
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MR. WALKER:
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THE COURT:
FR
09:25:57
Yes.
09:26:49
All right.
09:27:02
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Mr. Murdy?
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MR. MURDY:
THE COURT:
MR. KILLEBREW:
THE COURT:
All right.
09:27:11
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THE COURT:
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A week, Judge?
09:27:36
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MR. YOUNG:
Not necessarily.
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hearing.
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FR
09:27:54
IEN
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MR. MASTERSON:
DS
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09:27:19
09:28:11
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THE COURT:
All right.
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
THE COURT:
THE COURT:
MR. WALKER:
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called.
THE COURT:
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MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
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All right.
09:28:34
Okay.
THE COURT:
09:28:53
taking?
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MR. MASTERSON:
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THE COURT:
FR
MR. MASTERSON:
IEN
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We do not.
DS
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09:28:26
MR. MASTERSON:
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All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
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09:28:19
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That is correct.
Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
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MR. MASTERSON:
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Okay.
evidence.
the stand?
09:29:22
MR. YOUNG:
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So
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THE COURT:
All right.
MR. YOUNG:
Well, I guess --
09:29:38
Two hours.
THE COURT:
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All right.
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DS
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going to admit and what exhibits I'm not going to admit before
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FR
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09:29:49
IEN
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09:29:09
MR. MASTERSON:
And
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Yes.
MR. MASTERSON:
09:30:25
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09:30:46
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Mr. Young.
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MR. YOUNG:
We do.
THE COURT:
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a preference to do it in writing?
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MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
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Do you have
09:30:55
I do, yes.
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writing, I'll let you do that, but I'm not going to require you
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to do that.
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IEN
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FR
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09:31:12
I'm
09:31:25
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and why don't we handle this scheduling stuff when we're not
this.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
than a week.
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A.
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Q.
And that's part of the discussion that you were having with
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A.
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Q.
Okay.
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MR. MASTERSON:
09:32:48
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THE COURT:
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(Pause in proceedings.)
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THE COURT:
FR
09:32:28
Mr. Montgomery; it's not for the truth of the matter asserted.
IEN
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MR. YOUNG:
DS
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09:32:11
MR. MASTERSON:
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09:31:42
09:33:25
MR. YOUNG:
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Yeah.
THE WITNESS:
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
Well, Mr. Zullo, you were concerned when you heard from
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A.
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Q.
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THE COURT:
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please.
Objection, foundation.
Overruled.
THE WITNESS:
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Q.
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right?
FR
09:34:43
BY MR. YOUNG:
IEN
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THE COURT:
DS
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09:34:11
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09:33:55
MR. MASTERSON:
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09:33:43
09:34:59
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right?
A.
Q.
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A.
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Q.
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Holder, correct?
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A.
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Q.
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that you sent and received from Mr. Montgomery during the
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A.
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MR. YOUNG:
of the documents.
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Okay.
09:35:56
relevance, 403.
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THE COURT:
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FR
09:36:20
MR. MASTERSON:
IEN
22
09:35:35
DS
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09:35:23
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any other objections that they want to make and I can rule on
of the briefing.
MR. YOUNG:
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09:36:52
rather, be played.
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It's
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THE COURT:
15
Is
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the recording?
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not sure that you -- I'm not sure whether it makes any sense to
IEN
DS
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FR
25
09:37:42
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09:37:19
09:38:01
I'm
If you're going to
09:38:15
you.
MR. YOUNG:
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All right.
MR. YOUNG:
-- have anything.
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
Sure.
10
THE COURT:
All right.
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mike.
water.
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THE COURT:
Oh, sorry.
All right.
Mr. Walker?
MR. WALKER:
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IEN
DS
THE COURT:
09:39:06
So he's just
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FR
09:38:57
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09:38:51
court reporter.)
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09:38:30
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THE COURT:
09:39:20
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anybody else.
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and that will be based on who and what you may be able to
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MR. YOUNG:
Yes.
THE COURT:
whatever you say when you interrupt the recording and ask a
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IEN
DS
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09:40:25
All right?
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
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FR
09:40:15
recording --
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09:39:58
12
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09:39:37
09:40:35
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MR. MASTERSON:
MR. WALKER:
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MR. MURDY:
THE COURT:
All right.
MR. YOUNG:
All right.
are.
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10
11
MR. KLEIN:
2980?
MR. YOUNG:
2979.
MR. YOUNG:
Stop it there.
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15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
A.
DS
MR. YOUNG:
09:42:15
23
BY MR. YOUNG:
24
Q.
25
asked:
FR
Let's resume.
IEN
22
09:42:00
Mr. Zullo, we just heard someone say, quote, They gave him
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21
09:41:02
13
20
I may stop it at a
2979 first.
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09:40:46
Mr. Zullo, there was someone on the recording just now who
Why would they tell you to slow it down?
09:43:27
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2
A.
Q.
because the time that they were asking at that time, I'm doing
Snow stuff.
A.
Well, it's
Objection.
10
Overruled.
11
BY MR. YOUNG:
12
Q.
13
A.
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17
09:44:01
14
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All right.
09:44:13
recording.
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BY MR. YOUNG:
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Q.
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DS
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09:44:33
IEN
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A.
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Q.
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FR
09:43:45
09:44:54
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Seattle investigation?
A.
Q.
A.
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7
All right.
09:45:07
recording.
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BY MR. YOUNG:
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Q.
09:47:15
12
13
A.
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Q.
This was at a time where you were having some dispute over
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A.
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Let's continue.
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DS
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BY MR. YOUNG:
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Q.
09:48:16
IEN
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you found out about Brian Mackiewicz and Travis Anglin telling
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FR
09:47:30
09:48:36
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A.
Q.
you had found out in that way, and Mr. Montgomery responded to
A.
Q.
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
10
Objection, hearsay.
Overruled.
THE WITNESS:
Object.
09:48:55
Let's continue.
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BY MR. YOUNG:
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Q.
15
that recording.
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A.
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Q.
Okay.
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A.
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Q.
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A.
09:50:07
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FR
09:49:55
DS
IEN
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09:49:10
09:51:38
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BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
that correct?
A.
Q.
right?
A.
10
09:52:43
11
BY MR. YOUNG:
12
Q.
13
14
15
16
right?
17
A.
18
Q.
19
21
IEN
22
MR. MASTERSON:
DS
20
THE WITNESS:
THE COURT:
Objection, foundation.
09:52:57
09:53:11
Wait a minute.
23
(Pause in proceedings.)
24
THE COURT:
Sustained.
25
MR. YOUNG:
FR
09:51:47
09:53:35
4334
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3
4
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
Q.
So you would hear from Mr. Montgomery that his work was
10
A.
11
Q.
Carl Cameron was a Fox News network journalist who had been
12
13
14
doing, correct?
MR. MASTERSON:
15
THE COURT:
16
17
21
please?
23
09:55:47
objection.
24
THE WITNESS:
25
THE COURT:
FR
09:55:28
IEN
22
THE WITNESS:
DS
20
09:55:11
18
19
09:54:50
09:55:51
THE WITNESS:
1
2
Okay.
Don't even
MR. YOUNG:
4335
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now, and I'm going to ask you whether the references about for
Snow.
8
9
BY MR. YOUNG:
10
Q.
11
12
correct?
13
A.
14
Q.
15
"He's the one guy you can hammer with," and I'm not saying
16
17
18
A.
MR. YOUNG:
BY MR. YOUNG:
23
Q.
24
25
FR
09:57:32
IEN
22
09:57:17
Let's continue.
DS
21
09:56:51
19
20
09:56:04
09:58:35
4336
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A.
Q.
right?
A.
MR. YOUNG:
10
11
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
14
Relevance is overruled.
overruled.
16
advisement.
17
really tell that until I can identify who the speakers are.
10:00:44
I can't
foundation objection.
MR. YOUNG:
DS
21
18
20
403 is overruled.
Hearsay is
15
19
You will.
23
MR. YOUNG:
24
THE COURT:
801(d)(2)?
25
MR. YOUNG:
As to both participants --
IEN
FR
10:01:18
that point?
THE COURT:
22
10:00:21
Exhibit 2979.
12
13
09:58:54
10:01:34
4337
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1
2
3
THE COURT:
Right.
MR. YOUNG:
-- in that conversation.
THE COURT:
participants are.
Mr. Masterson.
MR. MASTERSON:
8
9
testify and try to identify anyone, so I'm not going to, but it
10
11
recorded.
THE COURT:
12
Yeah.
10:02:00
13
14
a later date.
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
18
A.
19
Q.
20
A.
21
Q.
22
correct?
10:02:21
IEN
DS
23
A.
24
Q.
That's who you're talking about when you use that term in
25
FR
10:01:45
10:02:37
10:02:58
A.
Q.
3
4
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play.
minutes long, but we'll just play the first couple of minutes
of it.
And Mr. Zullo, I'm going to ask you whether you can
8
9
10
10:03:56
11
12
13
BY MR. YOUNG:
14
Q.
15
Mr. Zullo?
16
A.
17
Q.
Okay.
18
and you were recording from wherever you were sitting at the
19
20
A.
21
Q.
22
10:05:26
IEN
DS
23
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
10:03:37
10:05:38
10:05:54
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Sheridan -- said you should do, but that he, and maybe others,
A.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
6
7
Overruled.
10:06:11
8
9
Objection, foundation.
rest of it, but I will move for the admission of Exhibit 2980.
MR. MASTERSON:
10
10:06:37
11
12
13
THE COURT:
14
15
And 805.
same as before.
16
17
18
19
THE COURT:
DS
20
21
BY MR. YOUNG:
22
Q.
24
FR
25
Overrule
Yes.
Okay.
10:07:17
IEN
23
10:07:01
e-mail.
MR. YOUNG:
10:07:40
4340
OF
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BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
Q.
correct?
A.
Q.
10:07:58
10
11
12
A.
13
Q.
Okay.
14
A.
15
Q.
And then Mr. Montgomery told you that he could see that the
16
17
18
A.
19
Q.
And then Mr. Montgomery told you that someone should have
20
21
A.
22
Q.
24
FR
25
A.
10:08:27
DS
IEN
23
10:08:11
10:08:50
Exhibit 2258.
MR. MASTERSON:
1
2
4341
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relevance, 403.
THE COURT:
Overruled.
preserved objection.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
10
Q.
11
12
13
A.
14
Q.
15
16
topic was the work that you were doing with Mr. Montgomery,
17
correct?
18
A.
19
Q.
20
21
software, and that Mr. Montgomery will keep being paid, is that
22
right?
10:09:38
IEN
DS
10:10:24
10:10:45
23
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
10:09:58
10:11:06
exhibit, 2964?
A.
3
4
that exhibit.
MR. MASTERSON:
5
6
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7
8
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
9
10
11
12
to, the motion to admit them remains pending, pending the -THE COURT:
13
10:11:57
14
every time, but you have a continuing -- I'm not going to admit
15
16
17
objections.
18
BY MR. YOUNG:
19
Q.
20
21
A.
22
Q.
Okay.
10:12:17
IEN
DS
10:12:36
23
24
25
A.
FR
10:11:22
10:12:52
4343
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Q.
4
5
correct?
A.
Q.
And that was about the software that you were discussing
correct?
10:13:15
A.
11
Q.
12
13
14
A.
15
Q.
16
the middle of the page, you told Mr. Montgomery that you're not
17
18
right?
19
A.
20
Q.
21
22
IEN
DS
10
23
A.
FR
10:13:43
10:14:02
24
25
10:13:28
2965.
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
1
2
hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
3
4
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
Overruled.
10:14:36
6
7
A.
Q.
10
A.
11
12
THE COURT:
MR. WALKER:
16
THE COURT:
17
No objection.
10:15:21
No objection.
Amendment?
MR. MASTERSON:
19
DS
THE COURT:
All right.
So this is 2966?
2966 is
23
MR. YOUNG:
24
THE COURT:
Is that 2966?
25
MR. YOUNG:
FR
10:15:32
admitted.
IEN
22
Sure.
MR. MASTERSON:
15
21
MR. MASTERSON:
14
20
10:14:58
Exhibit 2966.
13
18
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10:15:49
THE COURT:
1
2
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
2966 is admitted.
4
5
4345
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THE COURT:
10:16:06
You may.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
Going down to the bottom of the first page and the top of
10
short window of opportunity to work in, and that the choice was
11
his.
12
13
14
A.
15
16
page as well.
17
BY MR. YOUNG:
18
Q.
19
20
A.
21
Q.
22
10:16:44
IEN
DS
You told Mr. Montgomery, you stressed to him, that time was
Was that --
23
A.
24
Q.
25
FR
10:16:24
10:16:57
10:17:14
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
correct?
A.
Q.
11
10:17:59
12
13
BY MR. YOUNG:
14
Q.
15
16
A.
17
Q.
18
A.
19
Q.
20
21
A.
22
Q.
IEN
DS
23
that you gave earlier this week, and it's going to be page 63,
24
25
MR. YOUNG:
FR
10:17:28
9
10
4346
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10:18:36
10:18:51
10:19:13
4347
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resulting unavailability.
unavailability.
that admission.
Mr. Klein.
"Question:
10
11
12
points, you mean the phony information you handed MCSO about
13
Snow... LOL.
14
15
"Answer:
"Question:
19
21
22
IEN
DS
20
24
FR
25
10:20:28
was and had been giving you false information about Judge Snow?
18
23
10:19:57
16
17
10:19:40
10:20:56
Seems
Form, foundation.
10:21:19
"THE WITNESS:
"Excuse me.
"Question:
3
4
I'm sorry.
"Answer:
"Question:
"Answer:
Fifth.
14
15
16
MR. YOUNG:
18
DS
THE COURT:
Any objection?
MR. MASTERSON:
MR. WALKER:
10:23:45
No objection.
23
MR. MURDY:
24
THE COURT:
25
FR
10:23:18
IEN
22
17
21
10:21:58
12
20
10:21:34
10
19
It's
13
I'm sorry.
11
5
6
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10:23:53
MR. YOUNG:
1
2
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
in as an exhibit.
10:24:06
6
7
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8
9
THE COURT:
That's fine.
MR. YOUNG:
10
11
12
All right.
13
14
15
reporter.
Exhibit 2967.
MR. MASTERSON:
19
21
IEN
22
hearsay, 403.
DS
20
Thank you.
17
18
10:24:33
MR. YOUNG:
16
10:24:46
THE COURT:
Overruled.
MR. YOUNG:
23
24
25
FR
10:24:16
At this
10:25:04
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the testimony that Mr. Zullo gave during his deposition that
I will
10
THE COURT:
11
But it
Withdrawn.
10:25:53
12
13
14
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
18
19
know it."
10:26:06
"MCSO
DS
20
A.
22
Q.
IEN
21
24
judge in August."
FR
10:26:22
23
25
10:25:24
10:26:41
4351
OF
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A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
Mr. Montgomery had told you about that Judge Snow had ordered
10:26:53
10
11
correct?
12
A.
13
Q.
14
you thought that the information that you had been giving --
15
and I'm going to actually look at the bottom of the first page
16
17
10:27:13
You
19
and then in your second paragraph you refer to, quote, the
20
21
DS
18
23
24
25
A.
FR
10:28:00
IEN
22
10:27:37
10:28:20
4352
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Q.
You told him and you believed as of December 16, 2014, that
that right?
A.
Q.
December 16, you told him that he had given you a cut-and-paste
11
12
right?
13
A.
14
Q.
You told Mr. Montgomery that he had just given you smoke
15
and mirrors, which sucked when all the smoke cleared, is that
16
right?
17
A.
18
Q.
19
Mr. Drake and Mr. Wiebe, who exposed Mr. Montgomery's deception
20
21
A.
22
Q.
IEN
DS
10
23
24
3:05 p.m.
25
FR
10:28:30
10:29:01
10:29:22
10:29:39
4353
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1
2
accounts for the time stamp sequence, but Mr. Montgomery told
you that he was tired of your threats and innuendos, and then
court monitor.
quote.
7
8
A.
Q.
10
11
12
A.
13
Q.
14
whatever.
15
A.
16
Q.
17
A.
18
Q.
And then you told Mr. Montgomery that he had made it all
19
up, and that you and others knew that, is that right?
20
A.
MR. MASTERSON:
10:31:03
10:31:15
please?
23
THE COURT:
24
25
MR. MASTERSON:
FR
LOL,
IEN
22
10:30:43
DS
21
10:30:29
Yeah.
10:31:49
4354
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4
5
And
monitors.
9
10
11
the monitors.
12
13
14
THE COURT:
15
MR. YOUNG:
17
19
and I'll be happy to point that out once that other exhibit is
20
discussed.
DS
subsequent exhibit.
THE COURT:
10:32:49
All right.
IEN
23
24
FR
25
10:32:37
There will be a
18
22
10:32:23
16
21
10:32:07
MR. YOUNG:
10:33:03
THE COURT:
4355
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2
3
4
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
Go ahead.
MR. McDONALD:
THE COURT:
Yeah.
It's 10:30.
minutes.
10
or --
THE COURT:
14
THE COURT:
16
THE COURT:
18
minutes.
10:33:26
Thank you.
Thank you.
DS
THE COURT:
10:50:09
Please be seated.
Mr. Young.
23
MR. YOUNG:
24
BY MR. YOUNG:
25
Q.
FR
(Recess taken.)
IEN
22
Okay.
17
21
Sounds good.
-- whatever.
MR. MASTERSON:
15
Right.
-- your objection or --
MR. MASTERSON:
13
20
10:33:25
THE COURT:
12
19
MR. MASTERSON:
11
10:33:10
10:50:18
4356
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A.
MR. YOUNG:
clip be played.
It is 2981B.
10
11
12
minutes 55 seconds.
It appears at these
10:51:02
13
14
15
10:51:27
16
MR. YOUNG:
17
Stop there.
18
19
BY MR. YOUNG:
20
Q.
21
22
correct?
IEN
DS
23
A.
24
Q.
25
FR
10:50:40
8
9
And
10:52:28
10:52:47
4357
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A.
Q.
A.
Q.
right?
10:53:00
It's a portion of a
10
A.
11
Q.
You did that while you were meeting with Mr. Montgomery
12
13
A.
14
15
Exhibit 2981B.
10:53:31
MR. MASTERSON:
16
17
THE COURT:
18
overruled.
20
23
24
FR
25
403 is overruled.
805 I
10:53:53
IEN
22
Relevance is overruled.
DS
19
21
10:53:20
make it clear.
MR. MASTERSON:
1
2
2981B.
3
4
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
No.
8
9
10
11
4358
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THE COURT:
All right.
MR. YOUNG:
-- for 2981B.
MR. KLEIN:
MR. YOUNG:
I'm going to
10:54:31
12
13
14
BY MR. YOUNG:
15
Q.
16
17
the whole thing, the whole project with Mr. Montgomery, was to
18
19
Mr. Montgomery that would show that the sheriff's rights had
20
been violated, and that would be a useful tool for the sheriff
21
to have.
22
A.
DS
10:56:07
10:56:24
IEN
23
Q.
24
process -- that was the thought process behind the whole thing?
25
A.
FR
10:54:17
Well, what did you mean when you said the thought
10:56:49
4359
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Q.
4
5
A.
10:57:34
admit 2981B.
10
11
12
13
THE COURT:
14
All right.
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
Exhibit 2967, in which you and Mr. Montgomery were having a bit
18
19
20
right?
21
A.
22
Q.
10:58:19
IEN
DS
10:58:39
23
evidence, we can just have it on the screen but not for the
24
gallery.
FR
25
10:57:57
10:59:11
4360
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A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
MR. MASTERSON:
10
MR. WALKER:
11
12
13
No objection.
10:59:42
MR. MURDY:
THE COURT:
14
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
18
A.
19
Q.
Okay.
20
21
A.
22
Q.
And then Mr. Montgomery agreed that the fighting was over,
10:59:51
IEN
DS
And then you told him that you were glad the
23
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
10:59:26
11:00:02
11:00:19
4361
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which you were telling him that he had been giving you crap and
your January 6 e-mail in which you said it was great that the
A.
Q.
Are you going to tell us what that was that happened that
A.
is going on.
Q.
10
A.
11
Q.
What happened --
11:00:51
12
13
14
A.
15
Q.
16
A.
17
19
20
21
22
through 20.
IEN
DS
"Question:
11:01:53
24
25
FR
11:01:23
18
23
11:00:40
11:02:10
"Answer:
THE COURT:
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
11
11:02:45
12
13
14
BY MR. YOUNG:
15
Q.
16
Mr. Zullo, you told him that Mr. Montgomery was continuing to
17
work with the Sheriff's Office at this time, and "this time"
18
19
A.
20
Q.
21
22
A.
DS
11:03:02
11:03:19
IEN
23
Q.
24
25
A.
FR
11:02:28
relevance, 403.
10
Any objection?
MR. MASTERSON:
Yes."
MR. YOUNG:
2
3
4362
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11:03:39
Q.
string?
A.
And then you had some discussion about Mr. Flynn with
5
6
2969.
THE COURT:
10
I'm correct.
11
screen?
12
MR. YOUNG:
Yes.
THE COURT:
All right.
15
admitted.
16
overruled.
805 is admitted.
805 is overruled.
Relevance is
403 is
18
questioning the ruling, just does -- did the Court see page 2
19
DS
THE COURT:
was a page 2.
23
24
FR
25
11:04:49
(Pause in proceedings.)
IEN
22
11:04:34
Relevance is overruled.
MR. MASTERSON:
17
21
11:04:21
exchange.
14
20
11:03:52
13
MR. MASTERSON:
7
8
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THE COURT:
All right.
Yes.
11:05:20
THE COURT:
1
2
MR. YOUNG:
Yes.
THE COURT:
11:05:33
8
9
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says "Mike" at the top of the second page, because that's the
10
11
that's below the line and the indication "sent from my iPhone
12
January 7, 2015, 2:54 p.m., e-mail from Michael Flynn" need not
13
14
15
17
We can do that.
THE COURT:
MR. MASTERSON:
23
THE COURT:
24
MR. YOUNG:
Correct.
25
THE COURT:
FR
11:06:15
IEN
22
MR. YOUNG:
DS
21
11:06:05
been redacted?
19
20
11:05:45
the exhibit?
16
18
11:06:27
consider.
MR. MASTERSON:
2
3
4365
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Oh, okay.
No.
the top line on the second page belonged to the first page of
the e-mail.
MR. MASTERSON:
7
8
9
Understood.
MR. YOUNG:
Your Honor --
THE COURT:
10
11
12
2 that Mr. -- I'm sorry, that have been made, but those will be
13
redacted, and then you can reserve, as you have with the
14
others, foundation.
15
MR. YOUNG:
16
18
THE COURT:
I did.
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
mean, can we get through the testimony with Mr. Zullo and can
22
IEN
21
23
MR. YOUNG:
24
THE COURT:
All right.
25
MR. YOUNG:
FR
11:07:18
your permission.
DS
20
11:06:45
17
19
11:06:35
11:07:30
11:07:39
4366
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you reserved.
Mr. Masterson.
MR. MASTERSON:
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
11:07:52
20?
THE COURT:
10
MR. MASTERSON:
11
THE COURT:
12
No objection.
All right.
13
14
15
16
17
BY MR. YOUNG:
19
Q.
20
21
A.
22
Q.
Okay.
FR
25
DS
IEN
24
11:09:01
18
23
11:08:40
THE COURT:
I'm sorry.
MR. YOUNG:
2970.
11:09:26
this one.
11:09:35
THE COURT:
4367
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Thank you.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
Mr. Montgomery that you were trying to protect him and get him
to the judge.
A.
Q.
your deposition.
1.
In the first e-mail at the top of the first page, you told
MR. YOUNG:
10
11
12
13
14
16
12:57 p.m., you told Mr. Montgomery, quote, 'It was me who
17
tried to protect you and get you to the judge,' end quote.
"Answer:
19
Yes, sir."
DS
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
No objection.
23
MR. WALKER:
24
MR. MURDY:
25
THE COURT:
FR
11:11:24
that testimony.
IEN
22
11:11:01
18
21
11:10:32
15
20
11:09:59
No objection.
11:11:31
MR. YOUNG:
1
2
3
4
4368
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hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
admit 2970.
9
10
11
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
You may.
12
BY MR. YOUNG:
13
Q.
14
correct?
17
A.
18
Q.
19
20
A.
21
Q.
22
A.
DS
16
IEN
11:12:17
It's at the
15
23
Q.
24
A.
25
Q.
Now, you also told Mr. Montgomery that you wanted to get
FR
11:11:56
11:12:34
11:12:48
11:13:01
4369
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A.
Q.
going to the feds about him, that is, federal law enforcement,
that right?
A.
Q.
10
14
15
correct?
16
A.
17
Q.
18
e-mail?
19
A.
23
24
FR
25
11:14:25
IEN
22
11:14:18
DS
21
11:13:53
13
20
11:13:17
11
12
hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
BY MR. YOUNG:
4370
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Q.
1:12 p.m. e-mail that you wrote to Mr. Montgomery, you said
that you met with the sheriff yesterday, that is, January 21,
2015.
A.
Q.
You met with him about the work that Mr. Montgomery was
doing, correct?
A.
Q.
11:15:23
10
hoping that you could get Mr. Montgomery where he needed to go,
11
correct?
12
A.
13
Q.
14
15
A.
16
Q.
17
18
19
A.
20
Q.
21
22
A.
11:15:44
DS
11:16:26
IEN
23
Q.
24
the second page of the exhibit -- you wrote that you were
25
FR
11:15:32
11:16:48
4371
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A.
Q.
You in fact -- did you have such a meeting with the sheriff
on January 26?
MR. MASTERSON:
counsel testifying.
he said the phrase "other idea," but then he adds words to it.
10
11
12
BY MR. YOUNG:
13
Q.
14
A.
15
Q.
16
11:01 a.m. you told Mr. Montgomery that without the sheriff,
17
18
is dashed.
19
A.
20
Q.
21
22
24
FR
25
A.
11:17:20
11:17:37
DS
IEN
23
11:17:02
11:18:03
Exhibit 2971.
1
2
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
4372
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hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
And
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
10
11
12
A.
13
Q.
14
15
A.
16
Q.
17
A.
18
20
21
23
24
FR
25
11:19:24
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
IEN
22
11:19:06
Exhibit 2271.
DS
19
11:18:34
MR. YOUNG:
11:19:45
11:20:01
THE COURT:
Overruled.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
MELC202288.
Foundation is reserved.
early February 2015, and one of those was the BC, or birth
10
11
A.
12
Q.
Okay.
13
that you were working on with Mr. Montgomery, was some data
14
mining project.
15
16
A.
17
Q.
18
19
20
A.
21
Q.
22
DS
IEN
11:20:58
11:21:14
11:21:31
23
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
11:20:27
8
9
4373
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11:22:03
4374
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right?
A.
Q.
correct?
A.
Q.
7
8
bottom of the page that ends in 223 and the top of the page
10
12
13
A.
14
Q.
15
16
correct?
17
A.
18
Q.
19
20
A.
21
Q.
And he asked you whether it would just upset the judge more
22
if the work that he was doing with you was ever disclosed, is
IEN
DS
11
23
that correct?
24
A.
25
Q.
There was some data that you were having Mr. Montgomery
FR
11:22:17
11:22:53
11:23:17
11:23:31
11:23:45
4375
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A.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Overruled.
THE WITNESS:
I answered you:
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
All right.
Objection, foundation.
11:24:02
11
differences with Judge Snow, you responded to him that you were
12
13
A.
14
Q.
15
16
A.
17
Q.
And then at 6:21 p.m. on February 2, you said, and I'm not
18
19
20
21
22
A.
DS
10
IEN
Q.
24
FR
11:24:43
11:25:05
23
25
11:24:27
And then you told Mr. Montgomery that "this guy" is never
11:25:18
4376
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A.
Q.
All right.
understood, and he asked you whether it was your desire for him
A.
Q.
10
11
12
get the sheriff back, and then we will go for the data.
11:25:58
And then you told him that you would share your plan
13
with him, Mr. Montgomery, once you got the sheriff back in the
15
16
A.
17
Q.
18
told Mr. Montgomery that your plan was going to kill two birds
19
20
A.
21
Q.
22
A.
IEN
DS
14
23
Q.
24
me -- the other bird that you were going to kill with the stone
25
FR
11:25:39
11:26:20
11:26:38
11:26:51
A.
Q.
A.
I'll do it now.
MR. MASTERSON:
6
7
MR. YOUNG:
4377
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THE COURT:
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
10
Yeah.
MR. MASTERSON:
11
11:27:29
12
13
et cetera.
THE COURT:
14
Yeah.
15
I don't think it's being admitted for the truth of the matter
16
asserted.
17
foundation objection.
18
BY MR. YOUNG:
19
Q.
20
Exhibit 2981A.
21
DS
11:27:56
I'm going
23
24
25
FR
11:27:38
IEN
22
11:27:11
11:28:22
4378
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2
3
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
Q.
Okay.
information you were hoping that he would give you how you
A.
10
Q.
One of the things that Mr. Montgomery told you was that you
11
12
13
14
A.
15
Q.
16
right?
17
A.
18
Q.
19
A.
20
Q.
21
him, correct?
22
A.
DS
11:30:48
11:31:08
11:31:18
IEN
23
Q.
24
25
FR
11:30:34
11:31:34
4379
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A.
Q.
the IRS for tax evasion if he could get access to their bank
A.
6
7
question.
it.
That's argumentative.
THE COURT:
11:31:57
It is.
10
consider it.
11
BY MR. YOUNG:
12
Q.
13
you were talking to him and he was talking to you about what
14
15
A.
17
Q.
18
19
20
21
matter.
DS
16
23
on that issue?
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
11:32:31
11:32:50
IEN
22
11:32:11
11:33:06
MR. YOUNG:
4
5
Mr. Montgomery?
MR. MASTERSON:
hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
10
to foundation.
11
11:33:48
12
13
BY MR. YOUNG:
14
Q.
15
16
17
18
correct?
19
A.
20
Q.
21
A.
22
Q.
You were talking about what Mr. Montgomery should do, and
IEN
DS
23
24
25
A.
FR
11:33:34
Mr. Masterson?
4380
OF
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11:34:32
11:34:43
11:35:07
Q.
e-mail, correct?
A.
You knew what the Judge Snow info was when you got that
4
5
11:35:20
MR. MASTERSON:
hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
8
9
Exhibit 2273.
6
7
4381
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as to foundation.
10
BY MR. YOUNG:
11
Q.
11:35:34
12
14
A.
15
Q.
16
A.
17
Q.
18
19
is that right?
20
A.
21
Q.
Okay.
MR. YOUNG:
IEN
22
DS
13
23
24
FR
25
11:35:52
11:36:04
MR. MASTERSON:
11:36:16
4382
OF
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THE COURT:
Yes, sir.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
10
Q.
11
12
13
correct?
14
A.
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
18
DS
THE COURT:
22
BY MR. YOUNG:
IEN
foundation.
FR
25
11:37:01
hearsay, 403.
21
24
11:36:47
(Pause in proceedings.)
17
23
MR. MASTERSON:
16
20
15
19
11:36:27
Q.
11:37:23
an April 20, 2015 e-mail that you sent to Larry Klayman and
11:37:46
4383
OF
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exchange that you had, at least on the first page, with Larry
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
Also among you and Mr. Klayman and Mr. Zullo, and also
It's an e-mail
11:38:08
10
11
A.
12
Q.
13
Mr. Montgomery to finish his work, and you asked for a response
14
15
A.
16
Q.
17
18
A.
MR. YOUNG:
23
hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
24
overruled.
25
BY MR. YOUNG:
FR
11:39:02
MR. MASTERSON:
IEN
22
Exhibit 2279.
DS
21
11:38:45
19
20
11:38:27
Same ruling.
11:39:13
Q.
4384
OF
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2
3
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
11
A.
12
Q.
Did you tell Mr. Montgomery that you had talked to Sheriff
13
Arpaio and Chief Sheridan on May 21, 2015, and told them that
14
you would not be testifying to the same thing that they had
15
16
A.
17
Q.
18
19
correct?
20
A.
21
Q.
22
IEN
DS
10
11:40:02
11:40:24
11:40:40
23
24
A.
25
Fifth.
FR
11:39:37
I am taking the
11:41:15
Q.
A.
4
5
11:41:39
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
8
9
Exhibit 2972.
6
7
4385
OF
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material?
MR. MASTERSON:
10
11
12
Sheridan.
13
THE COURT:
14
15
16
foundation.
MR. MASTERSON:
17
11:42:04
So
Thank you.
18
BY MR. YOUNG:
19
Q.
20
21
22
A.
DS
11:42:49
IEN
23
Q.
24
25
FR
11:42:28
11:43:18
4386
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1
2
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
10
11
A.
12
Q.
13
14
15
11:43:58
I'll
11:44:25
16
17
BY MR. YOUNG:
19
Q.
20
A.
11:45:09
IEN
22
DS
18
21
It is
23
24
motion here.
FR
25
11:43:39
THE COURT:
11:45:27
4387
OF
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foundation.
MR. MASTERSON:
5
6
Yes, Judge.
Foundation, relevance --
reserve as to foundation.
BY MR. YOUNG:
10
Q.
11
13
14
15
A.
16
Q.
17
meeting, correct?
18
A.
19
Q.
Okay.
A.
23
Q.
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
11:46:37
IEN
22
11:46:16
DS
21
11:45:55
12
20
11:45:42
11:46:48
4388
OF
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A.
Q.
that right?
A.
Q.
10
11
12
A.
13
Q.
14
among the items you recently gave to the Jones, Skelton law
15
firm, correct?
16
A.
11:47:47
MR. YOUNG:
played.
19
20
21
DS
18
THE COURT:
23
MR. YOUNG:
2978.
24
THE COURT:
All right.
IEN
FR
25
11:47:32
17
22
11:47:10
11:48:07
11:48:19
MR. YOUNG:
1
2
4389
OF
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All right.
5
6
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
beginning.
10
A.
11
Q.
12
correct?
13
A.
14
Q.
15
that right?
16
A.
11:48:52
11:48:56
17
18
19
BY MR. YOUNG:
21
Q.
22
DS
20
12:08:28
IEN
23
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
11:48:43
12:08:41
A.
3
4
a lunch break.
THE COURT:
5
6
4390
OF
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All right.
We'll be
back at 1:30.
THE COURT:
Please be seated.
9
10
11
12
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
Please do so.
MR. YOUNG:
Thank you.
13
BY MR. YOUNG:
14
Q.
15
that was a meeting that occurred, that you were part of, that
16
17
18
A.
19
Q.
20
A.
13:37:47
23
MR. MASTERSON:
24
THE COURT:
25
THE WITNESS:
FR
13:37:28
IEN
22
13:37:18
DS
21
12:08:55
Objection, foundation.
Overruled.
Taking the Fifth, sir.
13:38:01
4391
OF
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BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
2013.
5
6
A.
MR. MASTERSON:
8
9
hearsay, 403.
THE COURT:
10
Okay.
11
12
BY MR. YOUNG:
13
Q.
14
15
16
MR. YOUNG:
17
23
24
FR
25
13:38:49
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Objection, foundation.
DS
13:39:22
IEN
22
photograph.
19
21
13:38:36
18
20
13:38:16
Your Honor.
THE COURT:
13:39:33
MR. YOUNG:
4392
OF
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Yes.
2
3
portion of it for Mr. Zullo, and I'm going to ask him some
It is 2977.
13:39:49
7
8
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
10
11
12
correct?
13
A.
14
Q.
15
16
A.
MR. YOUNG:
Okay.
recording.
19
13:41:38
DS
20
21
BY MR. YOUNG:
22
Q.
IEN
23
24
A.
25
Q.
FR
13:40:49
17
18
13:40:36
13:41:48
2
3
A.
Q.
A.
6
7
13:42:11
Exhibit 2977.
MR. MASTERSON:
8
9
4393
OF
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10
If
11
12
13
14
15
16
Yes, sir.
THE COURT:
Thank you.
MR. YOUNG:
18
Mr. Masterson.
CROSS-EXAMINATION
19
BY MR. MASTERSON:
21
Q.
22
A.
Good afternoon.
IEN
DS
20
23
Q.
24
FR
13:42:45
17
25
13:42:29
13:43:36
13:43:53
4394
OF
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A.
the Fifth.
representation.
Q.
A.
I have no
13:44:18
10
11
12
13
Q.
14
15
A.
Yes, sir.
16
Q.
17
A.
18
Q.
13:45:07
21
here.
DS
A.
13:45:34
IEN
24
THE COURT:
25
(Pause in proceedings.)
FR
20
23
13:44:40
19
22
I mean, just
You may.
13:46:10
MR. MASTERSON:
THE WITNESS:
4395
OF
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BY MR. MASTERSON:
Q.
(Handing).
Thank you.
13:46:33
A.
Q.
I'm looking at page -- or, excuse me, page 71, line 11,
10
11
12
13
14
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
Hearsay.
THE COURT:
MR. MASTERSON:
15
13:46:50
I can
16
17
18
I objected.
19
21
asked.
DS
20
THE COURT:
IEN
22
23
24
FR
25
13:47:06
13:47:31
MR. MASTERSON:
Is
13:47:56
4396
OF
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THE COURT:
It says:
At a
hearing or a trial.
conditions.
It might say
doesn't overcome, at least unless you can show me, the hearsay
10
13:48:25
MR. MASTERSON:
12
13
THE COURT:
THE COURT:
15
THE COURT:
DS
THE COURT:
Excuse me?
MR. MASTERSON:
IEN
24
correct?"
FR
13:48:52
"In that
23
25
13:48:44
MR. MASTERSON:
19
22
MR. MASTERSON:
18
21
impression?
17
20
Eight oh --
MR. MASTERSON:
14
16
exception.
11
13:48:07
THE COURT:
13:49:02
4397
OF
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BO
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Overrule -- or sustained.
BY MR. MASTERSON:
Q.
A.
Yes.
Q.
correct?"
13:49:49
"In
10
13:50:06
A.
Yes.
12
Q.
13
A.
Yes.
14
Q.
15
A.
"Hell, no."
16
Q.
17
question?
18
A.
I don't recall.
19
Q.
20
line 16 --
21
A.
13:50:15
I may have.
13:50:30
IEN
22
DS
11
objection.
24
25
FR
23
4398
OF
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.CO
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stricken.
MR. MASTERSON:
It's stricken.
He testified
Objection sustained.
BY MR. MASTERSON:
Q.
10
A.
No, sir.
13:51:54
11
12
13
14
THE COURT:
15
you will invoke the Fifth Amendment or whether you will not
16
17
that.
THE WITNESS:
18
THE COURT:
19
21
22
IEN
DS
13:52:20
24
THE WITNESS:
25
THE COURT:
FR
13:52:09
20
23
13:51:10
Um-hum.
13:52:35
THE WITNESS:
Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
4399
OF
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answer.
"Question:
10
11
12
"Answer.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
MR. WALKER:
18
IEN
22
13:53:32
Mr. Murdy.
MR. MURDY:
THE COURT:
Mr. Young.
MR. YOUNG:
23
24
BY MR. YOUNG:
25
Q.
FR
No further
Mr. Walker?
THE COURT:
DS
19
21
questions.
17
20
No, sir.
understand."
15
16
13:51:47
13
14
13:52:49
13:53:40
REDIRECT EXAMINATION
13:53:54
4400
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A.
Q.
Okay.
A.
Q.
And then you said it was never your intention, or never the
A.
Correct.
10
Q.
Okay.
11
12
13:54:26
13
15
Mr. Montgomery's mapping out of cell phone calls and line calls
16
17
A.
Correct.
18
Q.
19
20
A.
No, sir.
21
Q.
22
IEN
DS
14
23
that right?
24
A.
Yes.
25
Q.
FR
13:54:10
13:54:54
13:55:12
13:55:30
4401
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A.
Q.
A.
Yes, sir.
Q.
10
13:56:21
11
A.
Yes, sir.
12
Q.
And then he tells you that he's being attacked for not
13
14
15
cross-examination.
THE COURT:
16
13:56:34
Overruled.
THE WITNESS:
17
18
BY MR. YOUNG:
19
Q.
20
21
A.
22
IEN
23
24
FR
25
DS
Okay.
13:55:47
13:56:49
Had nothing
13:57:07
4402
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about.
believed to be obtained.
5
6
to him that you tried to lambast me with and say I was trying
a victim.
10
He was
That's
13:57:45
11
12
cared.
13
14
tapped.
15
16
this man.
17
Q.
18
19
20
A.
21
Phoenix, Arizona.
22
24
FR
25
13:58:01
And the way you found out that he was a victim was that you
DS
IEN
23
13:57:24
Maricopa County?
13:58:19
He said:
Federal judges in
Yes.
As a matter of fact,
13:58:35
County.
4403
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know.
needed these.
Q.
A.
Glasses, yes.
I didn't know.
Hey, who is
Brian didn't
I refused to believe I
Believe me,
10
11
didn't know.
12
some more.
13
is that it?
Brian said:
He goes:
I go:
I don't know.
I go:
Finally I find an
16
17
18
13:59:24
No,
I had no idea.
19
21
22
IEN
DS
20
13:59:46
24
your database.
25
FR
13:59:04
Brian,
15
23
We're looking
14
13:58:52
And he
You're
14:00:02
they are.
for banking.
4404
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IRS.
And he said:
This is
database, these 425 hard drives, you have Judge Snow, a federal
Q.
And he goes:
Yeah,
And did you tell Sheriff Arpaio that you'd found some
10
11
Judge Snow?
12
A.
13
14
decision was, not even talking about the flow chart -- which,
15
16
twice, and Chief Sheridan, never to pursue this judge like you
17
14:00:39
14:00:52
18
20
21
22
IEN
DS
19
14:01:08
Because if he could, it
23
24
25
FR
14:00:18
4405
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1
2
It wasn't happening the way you laid out here for four hours.
Q.
Sheridan the plan to try to get Montgomery to give you the IRS
A.
Absolutely.
10
Q.
When did you first discuss this plan with Sheriff Arpaio
11
12
A.
13
14
Q.
15
It's 2074.
20
It's on the
DS
screen.
14:02:43
IEN
A.
23
Q.
24
25
A.
FR
14:02:17
It's at --
19
22
18
21
14:02:02
16
17
14:01:46
Okay.
14:03:03
4406
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Q.
did the plan to get the IRS and banking information relating to
date?
A.
mine.
10
know.
I don't know.
11
Q.
12
13
A.
14
high-profile people.
15
16
17
18
any.
14:03:50
Well, how did the idea of finding the name of the judge who
There would be no
14:04:10
It was
19
21
Ginsburg.
He represented he had --
22
Q.
DS
20
IEN
Wait.
23
A.
24
Q.
Yes.
25
A.
FR
14:03:20
14:04:29
Thank you.
14:04:39
4407
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Court.
matter to us.
4
5
of Arizona.
9
10
11
13
concerned.
14
kind of information.
15
16
McCain's information.
17
14:05:26
But that was the only -- Judge Snow, for all intents
18
and purposes, with all due respect, Your Honor, you were a blip
20
21
22
IEN
DS
19
14:05:43
We had
24
25
FR
14:05:13
12
23
14:04:57
14:05:58
4408
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I didn't
Because I
Q.
10
A.
11
12
never dawned on me to even ask to look for Judge Snow and what
13
14
Judge Snow.
15
16
to us that he had.
17
of multitude of problems.
18
19
information.
20
think the FBI probably would have walked in the door before we
21
22
information.
14:06:49
14:07:08
24
25
FR
14:06:31
DS
IEN
23
14:06:14
We
We needed Montgomery to go in a
14:07:23
4409
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hard drives.
Our goal
14:07:42
It's not our fault the FBI falsely raided his house
6
7
10
11
12
are some things this man said, I don't know if they're true; I
13
14
15
16
There
14:08:16
17
18
19
doing this.
20
21
to stop, sir.
22
Q.
DS
And you're
I need -- I need
14:08:36
I need to stop.
IEN
23
A.
24
star chamber?
25
FR
14:08:00
What is it?
Come on.
It's nothing.
What is it, a
14:08:57
4410
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my rights matter?
room matter?
Q.
little bit confused, and maybe you can help me with it.
Okay.
He was a victim as
14:09:15
6
7
A.
Montgomery came up
10
Snow.
11
think, you know, whatever the New Times writes, you're making
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
I think he meant
'Cause that's
22
IEN
21
14:10:05
23
24
25
FR
14:09:49
And
DS
20
14:09:33
14:10:26
4411
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2
3
with him.
7
8
anyone.
10
11
we get?
12
Investigating it the
We
14
is like the sheriff is the bank teller who gets handed the
15
stickup note.
16
17
in to us.
20
21
22
hotel.
DS
19
IEN
14:11:20
18
24
this.
14:11:35
He calls us in the
23
FR
14:11:04
13
25
14:10:44
We don't
14:11:51
4412
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this was.
So if that meant
The one thing the chief deputy said right away when he
6
7
this road.
10
14:12:11
No way.
14:12:30
11
12
Montgomery.
13
That e-mail that you showed me, he was mapping out phone
14
15
16
17
18
of breaches.
19
22
information.
IEN
21
Because we
14:13:00
23
24
25
FR
14:12:44
DS
20
If there is anything
14:13:21
4413
OF
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drive, seal the box, and go right to the FBI office and drop it
off, and don't leave there till you tell them exactly what is
going on.
day I'll tell you the story how I knew they were going to be a
Q.
A.
10
Q.
14:13:58
So you were the one who first came up with the idea of
11
12
13
talked about that to Mr. Montgomery, and then he's the one who
14
15
Internet.
16
A.
17
happened.
18
Q.
19
A.
20
man.
21
to mind.
22
14:14:15
IEN
DS
14:14:26
I -- when he
23
told me the name Snow, I didn't even think that was the real
24
name.
25
FR
14:13:40
14:14:44
4414
OF
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Q.
I mean, that's --
A.
other judge.
Q.
All right.
There
I didn't know
10
11
12
A.
Yes, sir.
13
Q.
Did you then tell that fact to Sheriff Arpaio and Chief
14
Sheridan?
15
A.
16
saying:
17
victim.
18
Q.
19
20
A.
21
22
Okay.
14:15:36
DS
IEN
14:15:24
Judge Snow is a
14:15:51
I don't know if it
23
Q.
24
25
FR
14:14:56
14:16:20
Phoenix?
A.
I was.
hearing.
in this county.
10
Q.
11
12
A.
14
15
things.
16
was back in this, or just getting back into this, and this is
17
18
Q.
19
A.
Yes.
I have no idea.
DS
Okay.
THE COURT:
24
THE COURT:
FR
14:18:03
23
25
14:17:43
MR. YOUNG:
IEN
22
14:17:01
2256.
13
21
14:16:38
something like 17, so I don't know exactly when that call went.
20
5
6
4415
OF
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Mr. Masterson?
4416
OF
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MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
I do not.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
7
8
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
9
10
BY MR. YOUNG:
11
Q.
12
is Exhibit 2258.
13
14
A.
15
Q.
16
him, correct?
17
A.
18
Q.
19
there's something --
20
A.
21
22
14:18:48
The next exhibit I'd like you to look at again, Mr. Zullo,
Is that an e-mail exchange that you had with
DS
IEN
24
25
Q.
Okay.
14:19:20
23
FR
14:18:26
11:35 a.m. he
14:19:32
14:19:53
4417
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A.
me.
Yeah.
5
6
2258.
7
8
9
THE COURT:
Is that 2258?
MR. YOUNG:
Yes.
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
Thank you.
2258 --
15
14:20:29
MR. MASTERSON:
16
THE COURT:
17
No objection.
-- is admitted.
18
19
BY MR. YOUNG:
20
Q.
21
22
IEN
DS
FR
14:20:44
It's
He
24
25
14:20:15
14
23
14:20:04
12
13
MR. YOUNG:
earlier admission.
10
11
A.
Yes.
Q.
A.
Yes.
Q.
A.
Q.
Well, yeah.
that.
A.
asking me.
14:21:19
MR. YOUNG:
10
11
Okay.
THE WITNESS:
13
14
15
16
life.
17
18
judge.
19
BY MR. YOUNG:
20
Q.
21
earlier.
22
A.
FR
25
Nobody was -- we
14:21:48
DS
Okay.
14:22:05
IEN
24
14:21:32
12
23
4418
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MR. YOUNG:
Exhibit 2979.
MR. MASTERSON:
14:22:21
4419
OF
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5
6
And I believe I
7
8
10
11
the exhibit.
12
15
16
17
like I'm going over stuff now that I don't -- I don't know what
18
I'm doing.
THE COURT:
19
21
the Fifth.
22
discussed it.
IEN
DS
in, Mr. Zullo, but you cannot invoke the Fifth and not invoke
23
FR
25
basis.
14:23:14
It's
20
24
14:22:59
MR. YOUNG:
13
14
14:22:38
14:23:24
THE WITNESS:
14:23:45
THE WITNESS:
1
2
counsel.
THE COURT:
Oh, I see.
question-by-question basis.
your invocation.
And it is on a
All right?
14:23:58
MR. YOUNG:
10
Okay.
Exhibit 2979, and I'm going to ask you about who the
participants in that discussion were.
14:24:14
11
12
13
14
BY MR. YOUNG:
15
Q.
16
17
A.
18
Q.
19
A.
Ish something.
20
Q.
23
24
FR
25
14:25:06
MR. MASTERSON:
14:25:28
Objection, foundation.
BY MR. YOUNG:
IEN
22
DS
21
4420
OF
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M
Q.
14:25:41
4421
OF
TH
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OG
BO
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Do you know?
THE WITNESS:
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
discussion?
A.
10
11
of this computer.
12
Q.
13
discussion.
14
A.
15
it like that.
16
Q.
17
18
19
A.
20
21
reconstruction.
22
14:25:54
14:26:13
That's my understanding.
I just categorized
14:26:29
IEN
DS
No, sir.
14:26:45
23
24
25
drives.
FR
What
14:27:05
2
3
5
6
THE COURT:
You may.
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
Yes.
MR. YOUNG:
14:28:01
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
21
23
24
FR
25
And I think
MR. YOUNG:
14:28:20
14:28:39
IEN
22
Now, it is
THE COURT:
DS
19
20
14:27:33
10
MR. YOUNG:
(Pause in proceedings.)
4422
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Mr. Masterson?
MR. MASTERSON:
law as to --
THE COURT:
MR. MASTERSON:
Let me explain.
that.
Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
As to what it does
14:29:07
THE COURT:
4423
OF
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Yeah.
10
11
12
13
respect to.
14
MR. MASTERSON:
15
No, Judge.
16
17
If,
20
21
22
IEN
DS
19
23
24
right.
FR
14:29:38
18
25
14:29:23
THE COURT:
14:29:56
14:30:18
take a break.
MR. MASTERSON:
4424
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I have a -- I have a
Anybody object?
MR. MASTERSON:
MR. YOUNG:
No.
14:30:30
10
MR. MASTERSON:
11
THE COURT:
12
13
14:30:44
I don't know.
Let's take
a look at it.
14
THE COURT:
15
16
I'm going to tell you why I'm going to take the break.
17
18
prevent you from invoking the Fifth Amendment any time you
19
wish.
You do
DS
20
22
IEN
21
14:31:11
And
23
24
25
FR
14:30:59
14:31:32
4425
OF
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question.
THE COURT:
6
7
8
9
14:31:51
I understand.
I don't think I
understood it.
THE COURT:
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
THE COURT:
17
14:32:15
Okay, sir.
18
19
21
THE COURT:
MR. MASTERSON:
24
THE COURT:
FR
Thank you.
Thank you.
14:32:28
23
25
All right?
IEN
22
THE WITNESS:
DS
20
14:32:00
I did, yes.
All right.
4426
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MR. YOUNG:
it's complete.
6
7
8
THE COURT:
648 F.2d?
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
14:32:51
Thank you.
(Pause in proceedings.)
THE COURT:
10
MR. MASTERSON:
11
I did
12
13
give a call back to the office and have them e-file it.
THE COURT:
14
17
18
21
23
Please be seated.
All right.
Mr. Zullo.
IEN
22
wasn't here.
15:05:49
I apologize.
24
(Pause in proceedings.)
25
THE COURT:
FR
14:33:49
THE COURT:
DS
20
Thank you.
(Recess taken.)
16
19
MR. MASTERSON:
15
14:33:36
15:06:15
4427
OF
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THE COURT:
Okay, sir.
think I'm starting to cross the line, please stop me, or let me
15:06:27
6
7
THE WITNESS:
THE COURT:
10
Um-hum.
11
12
13
does not prevent you from seeking to invoke the Fifth Amendment
14
15
16
17
But that
20
21
22
IEN
DS
19
24
FR
25
15:07:10
18
23
15:06:42
15:07:29
way of rebuttal.
What happened in this case, as far as I recollect, is
15:07:48
4428
OF
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4
5
information.
8
9
10
not.
11
12
this morning.
14
15
16
17
18
19
DS
22
IEN
I'm going to remind you that you have a right to invoke the
15:08:55
24
25
FR
15:08:35
21
23
15:08:19
13
20
15:08:04
Again,
15:09:13
4429
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3
4
testimony that Mr. Zullo has given -- all parties are receiving
dailies, right?
All right.
10
testified to.
15:09:49
11
12
13
14
15
in light of the fact that he's now coming forward with this on
16
17
where I might give them recross, and then allow you final
18
redirect.
THE WITNESS:
THE COURT:
IEN
22
DS
21
23
15:10:19
24
THE WITNESS:
25
THE COURT:
FR
15:10:05
19
20
15:09:30
I do, sir.
-- that I'm proceeding the way I'm
15:10:27
4430
OF
TH
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BO
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THE COURT:
4
5
I understand.
6
7
15:10:40
procedure.
THE COURT:
Mr. Masterson?
MR. MASTERSON:
10
11
12
13
now?
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
15
All right.
15:10:55
court reporter.)
18
THE COURT:
19
21
in.
DS
20
15:11:22
IEN
23
THE COURT:
24
MR. MASTERSON:
25
THE COURT:
FR
16
22
Do you want to do it
14
17
15:10:47
Oh, okay.
Okay.
We'll do that.
All right.
15:11:29
MR. MASTERSON:
1
2
have changed.
3
4
4431
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you --
THE COURT:
Yeah.
MR. MASTERSON:
-- at our break.
15:11:36
I'm a little
but I looked at the case and the paragraph I'm talking about,
10
and I'm sure you just read it, is our rule is that whatever the
11
12
ordinary witness may pick the point beyond which he will not
13
go --
THE COURT:
14
Right.
MR. MASTERSON:
15
16
17
18
19
MR. MASTERSON:
22
IEN
21
23
24
FR
25
THE COURT:
15:12:08
Right.
DS
20
15:11:56
No.
15:12:19
But it is my
15:12:36
invoke.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
3
4
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
THE COURT:
Okay.
15:12:44
MR. MASTERSON:
10
Okay.
just read.
4432
OF
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Okay.
15:12:53
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
This
18
brief -- I'm going to ask you to state the -- I'm going to ask
20
21
22
IEN
DS
19
23
MR. MASTERSON:
24
THE COURT:
FR
25
15:13:05
I'm going
15:13:19
Okay.
15:13:33
4433
OF
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know, temporary purposes today, then I'm going to let Mr. Young
question.
7
8
9
Okay.
I understand now.
THE COURT:
Okay.
MR. YOUNG:
10
11
12
15:13:54
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Um-hum.
MR. YOUNG:
15:14:02
13
14
15
Mr. Zullo does not voluntarily answer, I think you can just
16
say:
17
MR. MASTERSON:
18
THE COURT:
19
21
All right.
15:14:29
IEN
22
else here?
DS
20
23
24
25
FR
15:14:15
15:14:39
morning.
4434
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2
3
6
7
Yes.
THE COURT:
All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
8
9
MR. YOUNG:
15:14:53
the case law does say that you can't blanket invoke the Fifth.
THE COURT:
10
MR. MASTERSON:
11
12
13
THE COURT:
Yes.
MR. MASTERSON:
14
THE COURT:
15
THE COURT:
17
Okay.
MR. MASTERSON:
16
15:15:02
I understand.
-- we do that.
18
20
21
22
you --
IEN
DS
19
23
24
FR
25
15:15:08
MR. YOUNG:
15:15:20
But if
Yes.
Yes.
Thank
15:15:34
4435
OF
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you.
I'm sorry.
you're going to want to ask based on what Mr. Young has already
invokes the Fifth, the same procedure will go for you, which is
Mr. Young, that allows you to ask the question you're asking.
MR. MASTERSON:
And if he
And then my
10
11
13
we?
THE COURT:
18
Yeah.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
I think so.
Understood, yeah.
23
24
25
FR
15:16:24
IEN
22
-- recross.
DS
21
The answer.
MR. MASTERSON:
17
20
15:16:16
THE COURT:
16
19
14
15
15:16:06
Right.
MR. MASTERSON:
12
15:15:51
15:16:35
MR. MASTERSON:
3
4
5
Okay.
THE COURT:
Okay?
MR. YOUNG:
15:16:46
THE COURT:
7
8
4436
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9
10
if you want, but you also have the right to invoke the Fifth
11
12
13
14
repeat again.
15
17
18
19
given, they're going to file a brief with me, I'm going to make
20
21
IEN
DS
16
22
THE WITNESS:
THE COURT:
24
THE WITNESS:
25
THE COURT:
FR
23
15:17:02
15:17:17
15:17:33
Okay, sir.
All right.
Thank you.
15:17:40
4437
OF
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MR. YOUNG:
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
nine zero.
A.
Yes, sir.
Q.
investigation, correct?
10
A.
MR. YOUNG:
relevance, 403.
THE COURT:
Overruled.
18
BY MR. YOUNG:
19
Q.
DS
21
22
A.
15:18:40
IEN
Yes, sir.
23
Q.
24
25
A.
FR
15:18:26
admitted.
17
20
MR. MASTERSON:
15
16
15:18:12
Exhibit 2090.
13
14
15:18:00
Yes, sir.
11
12
And that was written during the course of your work on the
Yes, sir.
15:19:00
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Overruled.
4
5
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
15:19:17
7
8
A.
Yes, sir.
10
Q.
And that was done during the course of your work on the
11
Seattle investigation?
12
A.
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
17
and 403.
THE COURT:
19
Overruled.
DS
15:20:29
IEN
BY MR. YOUNG:
23
Q.
24
25
FR
15:20:15
(Pause in proceedings.)
16
22
15
21
MR. MASTERSON:
14
20
15:19:51
Yes, sir.
13
18
4438
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15:20:46
A.
Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG:
2
3
4439
OF
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2965.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Overruled.
6
7
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
Let's go to 2968.
10
11
12
A.
13
14
Q.
15
2969.
15:21:56
17
you and Mr. Zullo at the top, and then there's an e-mail at the
18
19
21
22
IEN
DS
20
23
investigation, correct?
24
A.
FR
15:21:27
16
25
15:21:05
15:22:28
Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG:
15:22:43
4440
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MR. MASTERSON:
My understanding is that, as we
5
6
explained.
10
11
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
12
THE COURT:
13
15:23:17
Relevance, 403.
Overruled.
14
15
admitted.
15:23:29
16
17
BY MR. YOUNG:
18
Q.
19
20
A.
Yes, sir.
21
Q.
22
A.
IEN
DS
15:23:52
23
investigation.
24
25
in October of '14.
FR
15:23:00
15:24:21
4441
OF
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forward.
4
5
Q.
you --
A.
10
Q.
Understood.
All right.
12
15:24:54
Exhibit 2269.
13
14
15
THE COURT:
2269?
MR. YOUNG:
Yes.
THE COURT:
16
decided that you were going to admit 2269A but not 2269.
17
MR. MASTERSON:
19
Overruled.
15:25:26
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
24
FR
I apologize.
23
25
Maybe
IEN
22
THE COURT:
DS
21
15:25:03
2269?
18
20
15:24:41
MR. YOUNG:
11
15:25:39
4442
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A.
Mr. Montgomery --
Q.
Right.
A.
Q.
Mr. Montgomery for, and how did that relate to Judge Lamberth?
A.
Right.
What --
10
11
15:26:07
12
13
14
15
16
17
He got production
15:26:23
18
It was a long
20
21
Q.
22
A.
IEN
DS
19
23
24
October.
25
FR
15:25:49
15:26:40
Internet or whatnot.
yourself.
Nobody
4443
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Q.
Judge Lamberth and the cooperation with the FBI that you just
10
11
THE WITNESS:
15:27:22
12
13
14
I don't
15
16
17
THE COURT:
18
20
21
23
24
FR
25
Okay.
THE WITNESS:
I understand.
15:27:48
I don't think
IEN
22
15:27:35
DS
19
15:27:08
conversation.
So I'm sorry, sir.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Yes.
4444
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Q.
Mr. Montgomery with Judge Lamberth, and some work that you
A.
Okay.
Q.
Okay.
A.
15:28:10
7
8
10
11
12
13
him.
14
15
16
what they did to him, and he was always crying for this
17
immunity thing.
18
21
issue.
22
Q.
DS
A.
15:28:58
August of 2014?
IEN
FR
25
15:28:45
20
24
19
23
15:28:28
I had concern
15:29:16
4445
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this thing in a box and just throw it to the FBI to get it off
our plate.
7
8
And in my thought
10
11
judge and throw this stuff up, let's see him do it.
12
13
15:29:53
That's how
14
15
16
We made arrangements.
15:30:13
I believe we -- myself,
18
19
20
meeting where we did bring Mr. Montgomery, who was recently out
21
of the hospital.
22
IEN
DS
17
23
brain aneurysm.
25
there.
15:30:34
24
FR
15:29:38
He has a
15:30:53
4446
OF
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documents.
story.
said to say.
He took
I do believe that
9
10
11
back the following week and discuss what our options were.
12
went back that third time and we did tell Judge Lamberth that
13
14
15
16
17
18
We
15:31:48
point.
21
DS
20
15:32:06
IEN
23
Look, you've got three -- three places you could go: FBI, DOJ,
24
25
that effect.
FR
15:31:23
19
22
15:31:07
15:32:29
4447
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1
2
this?
So if
Whoa.
9
10
basically come to the place where he had no roof over his head.
11
12
convoluted story.
13
bankruptcy.
14
15
16
17
players apart from each other and keep Montgomery in that house
18
19
20
And I was
15:33:51
23
24
whatsoever.
25
Klayman.
FR
15:33:29
IEN
22
15:33:04
It is such a
DS
21
15:32:43
I know it's a
15:34:12
4448
OF
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little scattered.
2
3
lose control of this CI, because Mr. Klayman would take the
7
8
Because the big concern here was if this guy has the ability to
10
11
12
at will.
13
federal government.
15:34:45
14
15
and say:
16
nothing.
There was
It was so limited.
15:35:04
17
19
20
21
22
Montgomery.
IEN
DS
18
He had
I read in newspaper
15:35:26
23
24
25
be processed.
FR
15:34:28
15:35:45
4449
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1
2
have where you see the calls, the telephones, to, from, name,
address.
information.
10
11
mindset that was here, I located the NSA people that actually
12
13
out of this --
14
Q.
15
A.
16
prosecuted.
17
18
just about the end of June, with one little spurt -- excuse me.
19
20
Q.
That's 2014.
21
A.
22
William Binney.
DS
IEN
23
15:36:19
15:36:42
15:37:04
24
25
FR
15:36:02
15:37:22
4450
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hard drives.
4
5
10
do it.
15:38:01
11
12
13
apparent to me that this guy was taking credit for building the
14
computer that did all the harvesting, but there was nothing in
15
16
harvesting program.
17
18
19
15:38:22
DS
20
22
IEN
21
15:38:39
23
24
said that, and I'm looking at the time line, something didn't
25
FR
15:37:38
When he
15:39:08
4451
OF
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2
3
up finding Mr. Binney, I believe, was first one, Kurt Wiebe was
Q.
A.
William.
employees.
bulk data.
15:39:26
It had a
10
11
court order to unencrypt it, and then they could access as much
12
13
14
15
16
17
with this.
18
19
office, and I'm explaining to him what I found and what I think
20
we can do here.
We
15:40:29
and I said:
23
24
25
FR
15:40:09
IEN
22
I said:
DS
21
15:39:49
That's
15:40:46
4452
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when we got the order from the chief deputy that if there was
Q.
A.
Q.
Of 2014?
A.
Of '14.
ended.
15:41:00
10
11
12
13
We had
We told
14
them what we had, what we were working on, and we asked them,
15
said:
16
17
18
19
20
21
DS
IEN
22
15:41:38
We don't
We don't know if
We've
They
15:41:53
23
24
transpired.
25
FR
15:41:22
4453
OF
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transport 50 hard drives, and not have them leave our sight
I think that's
15:42:32
after our arrival we met with Mr. Binney, Mr. Drake, at the
10
And
15:42:56
11
12
13
14
15
So he was
I stood
16
17
18
saying:
19
nothing here.
20
21
22
the drive.
This is nonsense.
DS
IEN
There's no
None of
23
Q.
24
A.
Well, I might as well just tell you the whole story so you
25
FR
15:43:10
15:43:25
15:43:41
4454
OF
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Q.
A.
4
5
Mr. Montgomery.
Mr. Binney.
10
11
13
in:
14
what he does.
15
16
17
18
19
us.
20
21
22
I want to spring this on him and see his reaction and see
FR
25
15:44:43
DS
I said:
IEN
24
15:44:25
12
23
15:43:57
15:45:06
neck, the top of his ears to his temples, it goes cherry red.
15:45:24
4455
OF
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I know he
4
5
diversion.
10
a sudden:
11
can't go.
He goes:
15:45:44
I described to
15:46:01
12
13
14
15
said:
16
reply to me was:
And his
17
19
20
21
all this information and he can prove it and he can prove it,
22
IEN
DS
18
23
the fact that he's got people's identities, and he's got a lot
24
of them.
FR
25
15:46:18
15:46:42
15:46:58
4456
OF
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we don't know what we're dealing with, we don't know who he is.
Q.
A.
10
15:47:31
11
12
13
him.
14
believe this.
15
16
17
account, or whatnot?
18
19
20
said:
21
same investment.
He said:
So it's
And he
DS
24
FR
15:48:11
23
25
15:47:51
Is this your
IEN
22
15:47:14
15:48:29
4457
OF
TH
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I understand that
And Detective
7
8
way it -- it ran was the executive told him it's quite possible
He said it
10
was quite possible he had that money, and I believe it was over
11
a million dollars.
15:49:14
But then Brian showed him his own password, and that
12
13
14
15
This thing is so
15:49:36
16
18
19
20
was impenetrable.
21
Q.
22
DS
17
15:49:55
IEN
23
24
A.
Yes.
25
Q.
FR
15:48:53
15:50:07
4458
OF
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A.
meeting with the FBI, and the FBI and DOJ have given
don't know what that is, and he has turned over over 600
That's my understanding.
Q.
Mr. Zullo.
Okay.
All right.
10
A.
11
yours.
12
Q.
13
14
Exhibit 2971.
15
A.
Yeah.
16
Q.
17
you and Mr. Montgomery dated January 25 and 26, 2015, correct?
18
A.
Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Overruled.
23
BY MR. YOUNG:
24
Q.
25
FR
15:51:40
IEN
22
15:51:04
DS
21
15:50:53
19
20
15:50:30
A.
Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG:
2
3
4
MR. MASTERSON:
Withdraw hearsay.
THE COURT:
5
6
4459
OF
TH
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Overruled.
Relevance, 403.
admitted.
7
8
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
10
11
15:52:31
12
13
A.
Yes, sir.
14
Q.
15
A.
16
17
18
In the
15:52:44
19
21
22
IEN
DS
20
15:53:10
He had told
23
these.
24
the sheriff, because it was something the sheriff could get his
25
arms around.
FR
15:52:17
15:53:31
4460
OF
TH
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3
4
Q.
10
So there was
15:54:07
11
12
the Department of Justice and Covington & Burling and Jon Kyle?
13
A.
Yes, sir.
14
Q.
Okay.
15
16
A.
17
produced those and we sat in the office with the chief deputy,
18
19
Q.
Okay.
20
A.
21
send them, but they just, you know, were just another piece of
22
DS
IEN
15:54:26
23
Q.
24
25
A.
FR
15:53:51
15:54:39
Are you still of the view that those are things that
15:54:54
4461
OF
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Q.
4
5
A.
stuff.
numbers.
10
11
12
13
Q.
14
Mr. Montgomery said he had about Judge Snow's IRS and banking
15
16
right?
17
A.
18
produced anything.
19
Q.
Okay.
20
A.
21
take that off the table again for fear that he may -- might
22
have it.
Okay.
15:55:43
He never, ever
DS
I didn't want to
15:55:56
24
conclusion.
25
FR
15:55:27
IEN
23
15:55:10
4462
OF
TH
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OG
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Q.
said he had about Judge Snow's IRS and banking information was
A.
8
9
10
11
Q.
12
13
14
A.
15
16
17
Q.
18
Sheridan?
19
A.
I don't recall.
20
Q.
When was the last time you spoke to either Sheriff Arpaio
21
22
15:57:07
We don't think
15:57:22
IEN
DS
23
A.
24
Q.
Approximately when?
25
A.
FR
15:56:37
15:57:33
15:57:57
4463
OF
TH
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I don't know.
Q.
A.
and said:
Judge Snow.
10
15:58:16
He says
11
12
13
it in his mind.
14
15
Q.
16
17
18
A.
19
20
That he goes even beyond what normal victim, if you will, has
21
in there.
22
indicates that they have harvested his IRS tax returns and his
15:58:50
IEN
DS
15:59:12
banking information.
24
FR
23
25
15:58:32
It had to
15:59:36
4464
OF
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BO
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M
haven't stopped asking him for it but he's never produced it.
Q.
A.
Yes.
Q.
A.
10
11
12
the bottom, you'll see every -- and I don't know how many,
13
14
15
16
16:00:03
If you look at
16:00:25
17
18
19
20
effect.
21
Q.
22
DS
16:00:40
IEN
23
24
Judge Snow?
25
A.
FR
15:59:48
16:00:56
MR. YOUNG:
(Pause in proceedings.)
2
3
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
little blurbs.
me.
Yes, Counsel.
THE COURT:
12
Overruled.
14
BY MR. YOUNG:
15
Q.
16
17
A.
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
19
DS
THE COURT:
Overruled.
16:03:13
IEN
BY MR. YOUNG:
23
Q.
24
25
Montgomery, correct?
FR
16:02:42
Yes, sir.
18
22
16:02:27
13
21
16:02:07
MR. MASTERSON:
11
MR. YOUNG:
10
20
4465
OF
TH
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BO
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16:03:38
A.
Yes, sir.
Q.
string.
MR. YOUNG:
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Overruled.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
10
11
A.
16:04:24
Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG:
12
MR. MASTERSON:
13
14
15
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
16:04:52
17
Overruled.
18
19
BY MR. YOUNG:
20
Q.
21
22
A.
DS
16:05:18
IEN
Yes.
23
Q.
24
A.
Yes, sir.
25
Q.
FR
16:04:00
16
4466
OF
TH
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16:05:31
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
7
8
4467
OF
TH
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THE COURT:
10
Yes, Judge.
Okay.
11
12
13
other objection.
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
16:06:19
17
A.
19
Q.
20
21
correct?
22
A.
DS
18
IEN
Q.
16:06:40
Yes, sir.
Okay.
24
MR. YOUNG:
25
MR. MASTERSON:
FR
16:06:05
14
23
16:05:41
16:06:51
4468
OF
TH
EF
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BO
W
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THE COURT:
2982 is admitted.
2
3
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
A.
Q.
Exhibit 2977.
8
9
A.
Yes, sir.
10
Q.
Okay.
11
The sheriff was there, Detective Mackiewicz was there, and you
12
13
A.
Yes, sir.
14
Q.
15
A.
Yes, sir.
16
Q.
-- meeting?
16:07:32
A.
19
Q.
20
A.
DS
18
MR. YOUNG:
23
24
FR
25
16:07:43
Exhibit 2978.
IEN
22
16:07:18
17
21
16:07:00
16:08:12
1
2
MR. YOUNG:
2978.
THE COURT:
All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
3
4
MR. YOUNG:
4469
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Is
THE COURT:
No objection.
9
10
BY MR. YOUNG:
11
Q.
12
13
14
A.
Yes, sir.
15
Q.
Okay.
16
17
A.
16:08:37
18
All right.
20
21
22
IEN
DS
There are a
16:09:13
And
23
24
FR
16:08:58
19
25
16:08:22
16:09:40
THE COURT:
3
4
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Is that acceptable?
Sure.
Okay.
5
6
7
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
Okay.
MR. YOUNG:
little bit and ask Mr. Zullo to identify it, have it admitted,
and then there may be certain sections that I'll direct us to.
10
11
13
14
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
Blixseth, correct?
18
A.
Yes, sir.
19
Q.
20
21
A.
Yes, sir.
22
Q.
16:10:57
IEN
DS
23
24
A.
FR
16:10:17
12
25
16:09:56
16:11:05
Yes, sir.
MR. YOUNG:
16:11:14
4471
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2
3
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
correct?
A.
Now we've got someone asking Mr. Blixseth what he does for
That's Detective Mackiewicz,
Yes, sir.
9
10
BY MR. YOUNG:
11
Q.
12
13
14
Detective Mackiewicz?
15
A.
16:12:28
16
17
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
19
21
Mr. Blixseth, it's not being admitted for the truth of the
22
matter asserted.
IEN
DS
20
MR. MASTERSON:
16:13:06
24
25
FR
16:12:43
Exhibit 2977.
18
23
16:12:02
16:13:19
THE COURT:
MR. MASTERSON:
2
3
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5
THE COURT:
All right.
MR. YOUNG:
44 seconds.
MR. MASTERSON:
9
10
I'm sorry to
interrupt.
16:13:46
11
THE COURT:
12
Sure.
MR. MASTERSON:
13
14
15
16
19
21
on what is hearsay and what I'm going to consider for the truth
22
of the matter asserted and what I'm not, Mr. Young, you might
IEN
DS
20
23
24
FR
25
16:13:55
MR. MASTERSON:
17
18
16:13:30
16:14:06
16:14:23
1
2
3
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THE COURT:
All right.
Thank you.
MR. YOUNG:
5
6
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
Mr. Zullo, there was a link between these two things, what
10
11
12
13
correct?
14
A.
15
Q.
16
A.
17
18
County.
19
for the CIA may have some information, too, as far as the birth
20
21
Q.
22
DS
Okay.
IEN
16:15:59
16:16:11
16:16:32
23
A.
Yes.
24
Q.
25
A.
No, sir.
FR
16:15:42
16:16:41
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Q.
was someone, Carl Cameron, who was looking into the story
A.
Yes, sir.
Q.
A.
No, sir.
Q.
10
THE COURT:
11
12
MR. YOUNG:
All right.
16:18:10
16
17
BY MR. YOUNG:
18
Q.
19
20
21
MR. MASTERSON:
DS
IEN
23
24
FR
25
16:17:19
15
22
16:16:59
13
14
That
16:19:15
Objection, hearsay.
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
16:19:26
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he's saying.
THE COURT:
going to consider what Mr. Blixseth says for the truth of the
6
7
8
9
10
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
Okay.
MR. YOUNG:
11
12
seconds.
So 2745.
14
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
18
A.
Okay.
MR. YOUNG:
DS
going.
23
BY MR. YOUNG:
24
Q.
25
whether he's got any advice from lawyers about the propriety of
FR
16:21:04
IEN
22
16:20:52
Yes, sir.
19
21
16:20:13
13
20
16:19:45
Okay.
4476
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THE COURT:
Overruled.
THE WITNESS:
Objection, foundation.
lot of times the sheriff kind of breaks out into some kind of
levity.
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
10
11
end quote?
12
A.
MR. YOUNG:
14
15
MR. MASTERSON:
16
Excuse me.
16:24:12
Let me interrupt.
17
said it's not considering for the truth of the matter asserted,
19
20
DS
18
THE COURT:
IEN
22
16:24:25
23
24
foundation for legal opinions, and I'm not going to give them
25
any credence.
FR
16:23:22
13
21
16:23:10
16:24:43
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
Well, before we pick up, we've now heard twice someone say
MR. MASTERSON:
about --
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
it --
THE COURT:
14
THE COURT:
16
MR. YOUNG:
18
-- 'cause --
16:25:18
Yes.
Okay.
DS
16:25:32
BY MR. YOUNG:
IEN
22
stopped.
Yes.
THE WITNESS:
17
21
THE WITNESS:
15
20
16:25:09
THE WITNESS:
12
19
11
13
16:24:59
10
4477
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Q.
24
25
FR
23
In
16:27:26
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A.
I think
that had to do with Mr. Montgomery's legal woes with the DOJ
Q.
16:27:39
10
but I think there's a mention of Thomas Perez, who was the head
11
12
13
so again?
14
15
16:28:29
16
BY MR. YOUNG:
17
Q.
18
19
A.
20
21
Q.
22
I don't know
DS
IEN
Okay.
16:29:17
23
A.
Yes, I did.
24
Q.
25
FR
16:28:00
16:29:40
4479
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2
3
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
say that -- and again, this is not for the truth of the matter
asserted -- but you heard him say that Dennis Montgomery had
hacked into the e-mails of Lanny Breuer and Eric Holder at the
10
A.
So during the discussion that Mr. Blixseth had with you and
11
16:33:12
12
13
14
BY MR. YOUNG:
15
Q.
16
17
18
it, right?
19
A.
Yes.
20
Q.
21
22
sheriff, correct?
IEN
DS
23
A.
24
25
FR
16:32:54
16:36:30
16:36:44
16:37:04
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feds.
Q.
I heard that.
16:37:21
A.
8
9
10
(Pause in proceedings.)
11
MR. YOUNG:
12
13
14
15
BY MR. YOUNG:
16
Q.
17
you who were at the MCSO that he wanted to keep this very
18
19
A.
20
that meant.
21
Q.
22
meant?
Okay.
16:38:41
DS
16:38:55
IEN
Well, what did that -- what was the context of what that
23
A.
24
25
FR
16:37:45
16:39:08
3
4
Exhibit 2980.
All right.
So I want to go now to
16:40:05
6
7
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
10
A.
Correct.
11
Q.
12
A.
13
don't remember.
THE COURT:
16
THE COURT:
DS
MR. MASTERSON:
THE COURT:
Correct.
Okay.
Overruled.
16:41:35
Exhibit 2980 is
IEN
admitted.
23
24
MR. YOUNG:
FR
25
16:41:12
19
22
MR. MASTERSON:
17
I don't -- I
MR. MASTERSON:
15
21
16:40:50
MR. YOUNG:
14
20
Ultimately,
18
4481
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of that exhibit.
16:41:46
Mr. Klein to start off from the point that we left off.
(Audio clip played.)
3
4
BY MR. YOUNG:
Q.
right?
A.
not uncommon.
10
4482
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It's
16:47:07
11
12
13
14
15
wasn't there, but it's not unusual for him to take an element
16
17
Q.
18
19
A.
20
21
Q.
22
16:47:27
DS
I don't know.
16:47:39
IEN
23
A.
24
Q.
Okay.
25
A.
FR
16:46:48
Q.
Okay.
A.
MR. MASTERSON:
10
THE COURT:
11
Objection, foundation.
16:52:52
MR. MASTERSON:
You're right.
15
All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
16
-- was:
Well, I --
16:53:36
something?
THE COURT:
18
Yeah.
that's the last thing I heard, and so I'm not sure that there's
20
21
22
know.
IEN
DS
19
23
24
FR
25
16:48:14
13
17
All right.
I don't
14
12
4483
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MR. MASTERSON:
16:53:47
I just started
All right.
16:53:57
MR. YOUNG:
1
2
Sure.
MR. YOUNG:
16:54:07
MR. MASTERSON:
and then he says "I guess" and then gives some speculation.
THE COURT:
10
MR. MASTERSON:
11
12
13
14
THE COURT:
4484
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16:54:30
Yes.
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
15
You may.
16:54:42
16
BY MR. YOUNG:
17
Q.
18
Mr. Zullo.
19
A.
Yes, I did.
20
Q.
And then you were talking -- you were asking Mr. Montgomery
21
22
DS
IEN
23
FR
16:54:49
That doesn't
24
25
A.
16:55:09
4485
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5
6
Q.
Knew what?
A.
But
10
11
12
know?
13
14
Q.
15
A.
16
Q.
All right.
16:55:41
How do you
16:55:52
17
18
19
BY MR. YOUNG:
20
Q.
21
22
IEN
DS
16:56:53
23
be involved in it.
24
A.
I have no idea.
25
Q.
FR
16:55:27
16:57:10
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you asked Mr. Montgomery how you could destroy someone using
A.
Yes.
Q.
A.
Correct.
MR. YOUNG:
7
8
Okay.
Exhibit 2981A.
MR. MASTERSON:
9
10
16:57:31
Judge.
16:57:44
(Pause in proceedings.)
11
MR. MASTERSON:
12
THE COURT:
13
Overruled.
MR. MASTERSON:
14
15
16
17
Exactly.
19
20
that that are unidentified or that are not agents of the MCSO.
MR. MASTERSON:
23
THE COURT:
24
MR. MASTERSON:
25
MR. YOUNG:
FR
Correct.
16:58:32
IEN
22
DS
18
21
16:58:17
16:58:47
THE COURT:
1
2
I think it's
Go ahead.
MR. YOUNG:
of Exhibit 2981A.
6
7
8
9
4487
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16:58:57
THE COURT:
MR. YOUNG:
Thank you.
THE COURT:
2981A is
admitted.
10
11
BY MR. YOUNG:
12
Q.
13
14
15
A.
Yes, I do.
17
Q.
18
19
A.
Yes.
20
Q.
Okay.
MR. YOUNG:
23
THE COURT:
caveats.
25
BY MR. YOUNG:
FR
24
16:59:19
16:59:26
MR. MASTERSON:
IEN
22
DS
16
21
16:58:12
16:59:41
4488
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Q.
4
5
A.
Yes, sir.
Q.
A.
17:00:06
10
11
Q.
12
A.
13
14
15
16
17:00:26
All right.
17
19
20
21
22
morning.
IEN
DS
18
23
24
FR
25
17:00:37
17:00:49
17:01:03
4489
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THE WITNESS:
THE COURT:
Thank you.
MR. YOUNG:
I think most of
the exhibits that are listed in our motion have now been
admitted.
I actually did not prepare today to ask Mr. Zullo about and I
THE COURT:
10
11
Mr. Masterson.
12
parties about how they try their cases, but it seems to me that
13
if you have matters that you want to ask about Mr. Zullo that
14
15
16
17
Mr. Masterson can -- or any of the other parties, can ask some
18
21
22
IEN
DS
20
24
FR
25
17:01:32
17:01:50
19
23
17:01:14
17:02:07
And in light -- I
17:02:21
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tomorrow.
afternoon, and make sure that I ask any questions I now think
All right.
sidebar.
So the
10
11
12
13
MR. YOUNG:
THE COURT:
All right.
MR. MASTERSON:
14
THE COURT:
15
MR. WALKER:
17
THE COURT:
18
Anything further?
All right.
20
21
IEN
FR
25
DS
24
17:03:07
19
23
17:02:57
16
22
17:02:39
THE COURT:
17:03:19
I will, Judge.
17:03:31
4491
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the Court in the morning, but I want to let everyone know I'm
All right.
5
6
8
9
10
Arpaio.
All right.
MR. WALKER:
rethinking that.
19
20
an affidavit.
21
DS
18
THE COURT:
IEN
23
17:04:24
24
MR. WALKER:
25
THE COURT:
FR
17:04:07
Mr. Walker?
17
22
17:03:54
15
16
13
14
11
12
I think so.
17:03:44
17:04:37
4492
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MR. McDONALD:
THE COURT:
MR. McDONALD:
hear arguments.
THE COURT:
Yes.
10
11
12
the 20th.
13
15
ago -- or not some time ago, about a week ago -- and I said
16
17
18
17:05:17
19
21
22
on the 20th.
IEN
DS
20
17:05:36
23
24
20th.
FR
17:05:01
14
25
17:04:49
17:05:49
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10
11
that doesn't mean if the rest of the parties can make it that
12
13
THE COURT:
14
16
17
THE COURT:
THE COURT:
MS. WANG:
IEN
22
Perhaps.
MR. McDONALD:
DS
21
Yeah.
17:06:37
First is Your
23
Honor had said at some point during the proceedings that you
24
might pose some questions that you would like the parties to
25
focus on --
FR
17:06:29
make ours.
19
20
17:06:20
Sure.
15
18
17:06:04
MR. McDONALD:
8
9
THE COURT:
17:06:49
THE COURT:
MS. WANG:
4494
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Yes.
-- in closing arguments.
THE COURT:
questions.
8
9
10
conclusions of law.
11
them?
MS. WANG:
12
Do you want to do
14
THE COURT:
15
16
17
18
with you.
19
20
21
22
and conclusions of law to try and parse out what I agree with
FR
25
17:07:20
I have kept up
DS
IEN
24
17:07:06
13
23
17:06:56
17:07:35
require quite a bit more work on my part rather than your part
17:07:51
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MR. MASTERSON:
asking me.
and --
THE COURT:
make sure, you're not -- the Rule 50, because we have taken
10
THE COURT:
11
Yeah.
17:08:18
12
13
MR. MASTERSON:
14
15
sense, due to how things have shaken out with the witnesses
16
so --
THE COURT:
17
MS. WANG:
19
21
23
24
FR
25
17:08:36
IEN
22
Okay.
DS
20
17:08:29
MR. MASTERSON:
18
17:08:05
And
17:08:53
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4
5
Not
So if I
10
11
12
13
Okay, Judge.
THE COURT:
MS. WANG:
15
Okay.
16
17
contempt.
THE COURT:
18
MS. WANG:
19
Right.
21
DS
IEN
THE COURT:
24
FR
25
MS. WANG:
17:09:34
20
23
17:09:25
14
22
17:09:07
17:09:47
arguments.
THE COURT:
Um-hum.
17:09:59
MS. WANG:
1
2
3
4
4497
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no --
Ms. Wang:
You've got
Your
kept separate.
THE COURT:
MS. WANG:
Yeah.
10
11
12
conclusion.
THE COURT:
13
We would
15
16
17
18
19
contempt hearing.
DS
22
IEN
21
23
24
25
FR
17:10:16
And to the
14
20
17:10:07
17:10:30
17:10:49
17:11:05
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contempt.
2
3
it at all.
9
10
11
12
13
issues.
MR. McDONALD:
15
16
17
DS
20
22
IEN
21
17:11:57
23
24
25
FR
17:11:46
18
19
17:11:35
MS. WANG:
14
17:11:18
17:12:15
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expert, the defense had reserved the right to call their own
4
5
So I instructed
10
11
12
13
16
THE COURT:
17
19
20
21
22
IEN
DS
17:13:17
24
25
FR
17:13:06
Right.
18
23
17:12:49
14
15
17:12:32
17:13:30
4500
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MR. McDONALD:
THE COURT:
Thank you.
So I'm
8
9
10
11
12
14
15
16
separate.
17:14:16
17
19
not your own counsel, but you make them to counsel who are
20
21
22
IEN
DS
18
And if -- or it's
If they are
23
24
FR
17:14:01
13
25
17:13:41
17:14:25
17:14:38
4501
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THE COURT:
All right.
MR. WALKER:
Thank you.
This colloquy
conclusions of law.
THE COURT:
10
17:14:51
11
17:15:09
12
13
14
15
16
And
17
If
18
19
20
21
suggested there might be, and if there are areas we can just
22
move off the table, I think it makes all the sense in the world
DS
IEN
23
24
FR
25
17:15:29
17:15:44
17:15:59
4502
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remedies immediately.
remedies.
5
6
to to understand it.
MR. WALKER:
10
11
12
13
14
this point.
16
THE COURT:
MR. WALKER:
MR. WALKER:
THE COURT:
IEN
22
THE COURT:
DS
21
23
24
FR
25
Yeah, I do.
19
20
17:16:48
17
18
17:16:25
15
17:16:10
Yeah.
Great.
17:17:06
Okay.
Thank you.
Anything else?
morning at 9 o'clock.
(Proceedings recessed at 5:17 p.m.)
4503
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C E R T I F I C A T E
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3
4
5
6
7
8
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
2015.
20
21
IEN
22
DS
19
23
24
FR
25
s/Gary Moll