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Page 1 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
MOST READ
(and will soon own more than half) rests on Credit Suisse data. This data is on
net wealth, which throws up all sorts of weird findings when you try to add it
Rod Liddle
the top 50 per cent. North America on the other hand supposedly has around
8 per cent of the worlds poorest population because significant numbers of
Douglas Murray
people in the States are loaded up with debts of various kind, making their net
people in the bottom 10 per cent the worlds poorest with most Chinese in
wealth negative!
Abbie Martin
to split up the data into deciles, this methodology would suggest China has no
3
4
Sebastian Payne
Berlins nightmare is
coming to pass
James Forsyth
Rachel Halliburton
Fredrik Erixon
Mohammed in pictures
Barnaby Rogerson
According to this methodology, the poorest 2 billion people in the world have
a negative net wealth. Someone who has 50p but no assets or debts would be
Steerpike
above the bottom 30 per cent of the worlds population. It doesnt take an
bottom to an overall wealth share figure for the bottom 99 per cent will of
course make the figure much smaller than a gross wealth figure. Oxfam
Isabel Hardman
9
10
has then taken this bogus figure, looked at recent trends (which show the
SPECTATOR POLL
share of the top 1 per cent rising) and simply extrapolated into the future to
get their headline (which seems a huge assumption given the potential QE
unwinding).
Aggregating net wealth figures is largely meaningless and not the way most
Should voting be
compulsory?
people think about poverty, or indeed the rich. That Oxfam has been able to
claim front pages with a nonsensical report throws up all sorts of worrying
questions about journalistic standards. But the more perturbing fact is that
Oxfams latest meme will now be repeated ad nauseam by those who wont
examine the basis of the claim.
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Page 2 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
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8 days ago
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8 days ago
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AJ > sir_graphus
8 days ago
Any money for those trying to tackle the causes of poverty, rather than the
symptoms? Seems a more long-term approach to me.
2
Reply Share
7 days ago
They want the government to give 10 per head of ours to charity because
70% of it will go to charity administration, marketing and heads who pay
themselves like CEOs without the risks plus a gold plated public sector
pension.
1
starfish
Reply Share
8 days ago
Reply Share
8 days ago
Yes, I noticed that the figure was mentioned on the Today programme, and in
the news headlines, for all the world as if it was an established fact.
5
Reply Share
7 days ago
How is using 'net' wealth a dodgy use of stats? Oxfam is not claiming
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coeehouse/2015/01/beware-oxfams-dodgy-statistics-on-wealth-inequality/#comments
Page 3 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
How is using 'net' wealth a dodgy use of stats? Oxfam is not claiming
anything false and you should be taking this article with as much of a dose of
scepticism as the Oxfam data... And you know what is a bigger issue that
using 'net' wealth in this analysis? Labelling things like poverty as "lefty
causes".
3
Reply Share
7 days ago
I think he explained it pretty well, just because you are in debt doesn't
mean your poor and cant put food on the table, not that hard to
understand really.
5
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6 days ago
Reply Share
8 days ago
Jacques Peretti has also been propagating the same nonsense in his two hour
'expose' of 'the problem' on BBC1. He seemed to focus on the lavish
extravagance of some UK based toffs who were buying Ferraris and quaffing
champagne.
2
Shinsei1967
Reply Share
8 days ago
It is a bonkers way of measuring wealth as, amongst other things, takes no account
of age or potential.
So a 28 year old Oxbridge-educated Goldman Sachs banker on a six figure salary
(that he spends on rent & high living) with a 50k student debt is comfortably in the
world's bottom decile, if not bottom 1%, when it comes to (net) wealth.
Whereas a 65 year old British woman, living in her 250k semi-detached house with a
state pension (a 250k asset in itself) is in the top 1% globally.
21
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5 days ago
I gave Oxfam an email about this, as I'm someone who would fit that category
(well nearly) and here is their reply:
"We are confident that our statistics give a true picture of the state of
inequality in the world today. Don't just take our word for it, Christine
Lagarde, head of the IMF, has quoted Oxfam statistics on wealth inequality
and our last report on inequality, which included statistics calculated on this
basis, was endorsed by the Chief Economist of the Bank of England.
The bottom 50% includes 3.5 billion people around the world. This does
include the indebted graduate with high future earning potential, but this is
very much the exception rather than the rule. This group is overwhelming
populated by people with little or no assets to support their livelihoods.
I hope this makes our position clear. Thank you for your interest in Oxfam's
report. If you have any further queries please let me know I'll be happy to
help. "
Torybushhug
Reply Share
8 days ago
Bob Geldof has placed his real estate in a Virgin Islands trust, I cannot see how you
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coeehouse/2015/01/beware-oxfams-dodgy-statistics-on-wealth-inequality/#comments
Page 4 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
Bob Geldof has placed his real estate in a Virgin Islands trust, I cannot see how you
would ever stop this.
JK Rowling, Russell Brand and Stephen Fry employ the best tax advisors money can
buy, these people are globe trotters and can domicile themselves anywhere.
Tony Ben despite gifting much of his wealth to his kids when alive still died a multi
millionaire. If even he wont share what hope is there?
Worse than fat cat Bankers as the lefty charlatans disguise their greed.
15
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AJ > Torybushhug
8 days ago
Sorry, this is just plain untrue. Russell Brand does not employ tax advisors
and JK Rowling is also known not to, to the extent that she pays more tax
than the rest of the super-rich combined. There are plenty of champagne
socialists to direct your fury towards, these are not two of them
2
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Kingstonian > AJ
7 days ago
"JK Rowling is also known not to, to the extent that she pays more tax
than the rest of the super-rich combined." Really? Is that a fact? Or is
this another "fact" from the Oxfam stable of dodgy maths?
2
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AJ > Kingstonian
7 days ago
She's been on record explicitly saying she does and she does so
because she believes in the welfare state and felt indebted to it
when it helped her at her lowest. Others have stated this to be
true. It would be extraordinarily brave or stupid to make a
public, principled stand knowing it to be untrue. I suppose it's
possible. But I think the burden of proof is on you if you want
to accuse her of that.
1
Reply Share
6 days ago
Russell Brand just accepts money to fund films enabling others to get
tax breaks. He's whiter than white..........oops that sounds a little bad.
Oh well.
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6 days ago
Leo McKinstry
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8 days ago
One of the equality lobby's most deceitful statistical exercises in the invention of the
concept of "relative poverty." According to this piece of sentimental manipulation,
anyone can be deemed to be living in "relative poverty" if their income is less than
60 per cent of the median, an entirely arbitrary threshold. On that basis, even some
multi-millionaires in Monaco must be living in "relative poverty" compared to the
multi-billionaires.
14
Reply Share
8 days ago
Indeed - a cunning way of ensuring that 'the poor will always be with us'. And
so will lots of highly paid charity jobs.
11
Reply Share
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coeehouse/2015/01/beware-oxfams-dodgy-statistics-on-wealth-inequality/#comments
Page 5 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
Torybushhug
27/1/15 6:08 pm
8 days ago
This obsession with wealth is a tragic tale really. Last night CH4's 'The Nile' showed
for example these peasant farmers living by the banks of the Nile that had a real
joyful life. I've encountered this in rural Turkey where people had simple but very
satisfying lives, chatting away on the porch at night after tending their melons, a
single light bulb lighting their bungalow, happy as Larry, none of the complexity of
western living, none of our hang-ups s and relentless chattering in our attempt to
perfect the world to ensure everyone is as wealthy and long lived as possible.
9
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AJ > Torybushhug
8 days ago
Very true. But Ryan Bourne fails to understand this and fails to understand
that relentless competition between one another to acquire more 'stuff' and
status leaves us all deeply unhappy. All the iphones in the world aren't going
to make him understand that how people think and feel is actually quite
important. In any case, a huge amount of tech development has come
through Govn. grants, something he should be more honest about.
3
Reply Share
8 days ago
Did they have watch that recorded their blood pressure and displayed the
current daily average on their smart-glasses?
Then they have no idea what happiness is.
1
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6 days ago
Pappu Italvi
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8 days ago
Now thugs at Oxfam will enjoy touring across the world with grants raised through
charity in name of spreading this manufactured report
7
Reply Share
8 days ago
What does this even mean? A manufactured report? 'thugs at Oxfam'? come
on.
Reply Share
8 days ago
Reply Share
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coeehouse/2015/01/beware-oxfams-dodgy-statistics-on-wealth-inequality/#comments
Page 6 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
Marcus
8 days ago
Reply Share
AJ > Marcus
8 days ago
Yes, and that should be celebrated, but this is happening in spite of widening
inequality not because of it. In developed nations we're going backwards and
it's not because global inequality is falling, it's because it's rising in our own
countries as recognised by the IMF and OECD. People like Ryan Bourne see
the world in terms of iphones and toasters rather than people and what
genuinely matters to them. That is why he and others like him are losing the
debate on inequality. They are drab men with drab ideas that people have
seen enough of and don't like much.
1
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Marcus > AJ
8 days ago
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AJ > Marcus
7 days ago
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6 days ago
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4 days ago
Erm no. People in the third world need smartphones every bit
as much as you do.
Reply Share
3 days ago
Page 7 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
Reply Share
3 days ago
Reply Share
2 days ago
Nope. My Phone rings and texts and doesn't get used that
much at all. I use a laptop for the internet. I have no need to
have my head buried in a phone when I am out and about.
So no I don't 'need' one. I don't really need any mobile phone.
Just like I didn't need one when I first got one in the early
noughties.
If I weren't married now I would have gone without even my
cheapy a long time ago.
How did people cope before the advent of mobile phones and
'smartphones'.
Michael990
Reply Share
8 days ago
"journalistic standards". Well, they died, if they ever really existed, with the advent
of the press release. Took a few years but now, as long as there's a press release to
reprint, the 'journalists' are content. The internet age has helped enormously of
course, because it's all now a simple cut 'n paste job.
5
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English_Independence_Movement
8 days ago
The Left don't hate poverty, they hate inequality: they'd be quite happy if we all led
short miserable lives living in mud huts without health care, just so long as no one
person had a single penny more than any other.
3
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7 days ago
It's not about inequality - that would be boring. It's about inequity, aka
justice.
davidhill
Reply Share
8 days ago
I don't know about dodgy statistics but Credit Suisse's 'Global Wealth Report' states
the same as the Oxfam's figures if you read it.
But it has to be said that this subject is the most dangerous growing situation for
future humanity as eventually the reaction and fire will be ignited by the majority
'have nots'. Even billionaires are aware of this according to a recent BBC programme
on inequality, but where apparently greed blinds them to the growing and presently
hidden discontent around the world. You can forget about terrorism, obscene
inequality will be the eventual tipping point to light the fuse of world violence and
human uprising. Don't rely on the Army to suppress this anger and people conflict
either, as most of the foot soldiers come from the 90% of the world's population who
are the impoverished ones as the 1% take from them year-on-year. For history has
shown with all backlashes that eventually the ordinary soldier sides on the people's
side and not the government or those who have created the situation. The French
and Russian Revolution are prime examples here where vast inequality caused such
events to take place.
http://worldinnovationfoundati...
http://worldinnovationfoundati...
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coeehouse/2015/01/beware-oxfams-dodgy-statistics-on-wealth-inequality/#comments
Page 8 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
http://worldinnovationfoundati...
5
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6 days ago
The ordinary soldier sides with the group which can afford to pay him.
Reply Share
6 days ago
No, basic common values kick in and especially if they affect their
family directly. There are greater considerations than just money in
this life I am afraid to say. Sorry to say if you are a former squaddie.
1
Paul Fletcher-Tomeni
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7 days ago
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7 days ago
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SelfSucientOne
8 days ago
Money is an agent of debt where too much debt brings on poverty. And there are two
types of debt, personal and private. Individuals can control their private debt but
governments have taken away our ability to control the public debt. It is the public
debt that enriches the "powerful" and burdens the middle class. It is this debt that
we the people have lost control of, we are indeed indentured servants.
2
AJ
Reply Share
8 days ago
Oh and the attack on charities is pitiful. Tell me how supporting inequality reduction
is party political when all parties have talked of its importance.
1
AJ
Reply Share
8 days ago
It is not a dodgy statistic in that it is not untrue and the data that Credit Suisse uses,
while far from perfect, is reasonable. Ryan is right re those in debt etc. but that
doesn't get away from the fact that a small number of people have a huge amount of
wealth compared to others, including those in debt. And that this is wealth without
the burden of debt repayment. If anyone here thinks wealth does not equate to
power and influence they are completely stark raving bonkers. If anyone thinks that
everyone who is wealthy is as cuddly as Warren Buffett or as reasonable as Bill
Gates, again, you are sadly deluded.
1
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Andrew Cole
6 days ago
I don't donate to any of these sort of charities. Their 'paid' representatives rock up at
my door, a different charity each day, sometimes 2 a day, Can I interest you
in.....Nope..door closes. They all have chief execs pulling a very hefty wage. They all
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coeehouse/2015/01/beware-oxfams-dodgy-statistics-on-wealth-inequality/#comments
Page 9 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
in.....Nope..door closes. They all have chief execs pulling a very hefty wage. They all
scaremonger and use propaganda.
Reply Share
Dodgy Geezer
6 days ago
...You might imagine that a global anti-poverty charity, such as Oxfam, would
celebrate this fact....
Actually, no. The clue is in the NAME.
Oxfam was a global anti-FAMINE charity. The problem for Oxfam is that its
proposed cure (giving money to build wells) was a staggeringly useless way to
address famine, and global high-technology, driven by global capitalism, has simply
solved the problem completely over the last 30 years.
So now Oxfam is looking frantically for another reason for existing, and trying to reposition itself as a 'poverty' charity. As Jesus pointed out, "The poor will ALWAYS be
with us" - so Oxfam is trying to obtain a lifeline based on relative wealth. Essentially,
it's morphed into a communist organisation.
In much the same way, the police are anxious for the illegal drug industry to keep
going, and the military and security apparatus have been advising murderous
foreign policy activity for years in order to keep their industry alive...
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Christine Mackay
6 days ago
I Chair a small charity trying to feed and educate the children in one Orphanage in
Burundi, one of the poorest countries in the world (www.orphanageofhearts.org).
We directly oversee that they get our donations and we don't have any paid staff to
ensure they get it all. According to these stats the relative pittance we are able to give
them takes them out of the 1%, making them richer on paper than some of our
donors. I will have to remember that when asking for support! Totally ridiculous.
Reply Share
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Page 10 of 11
Under Oxfam's dodgy maths, someone with 50p to his name is "richer" than bottom 2bn Spectator Blogs
27/1/15 6:08 pm
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